disk type objective

[Farley4Fan]

Yeah, well, why not both?

[InvisibleMan999]

i still think that we'd rather optimize the map design than making the disk objective less coherent with the other objectives. it's really not that bad that the disk objective promotes rather aggro then stealth, afterall it's stealth-ACTION-multiplayer.

Well if people want disk objectives to be pretty much aggro, then that's one thing and an entirely different point.

I just hate when people claim that you can stealth a disk with any regularity, because seriously... you can't unless the mercs are horrible or you get very lucky.

As far as whether an aggro objective is good for the game, that's a matter of opinion. Personally I think it's not. There aren't any objectives that have to be accomplished full stealth, so requiring an objective to be required with aggro just seems off to me. If there's any problem with CT now, I feel like there are far too many situations that require aggro. It's not that I want to completely phase aggro out of the game, it's just that I hate it when there are certain times when aggro is your only option.  This especially happens in maps when the objectives are too close together and disks kind of just encourage that IMO, because there's no need to patrol the disk pickup zone.

[Westfall]

I just hate when people claim that you can stealth a disk with any regularity, because seriously... you can't unless the mercs are horrible or you get very lucky.

I can stealth a disk back on good players. Its not too crazy of an idea, especially if you get a distraction going. You may not be able to stealth it back, but there are some of us who try AND succeed at doing so.

[InvisibleMan999]

I can stealth a disk back on good players. Its not too crazy of an idea, especially if you get a distraction going. You may not be able to stealth it back, but there are some of us who try AND succeed at doing so.

I keep hearing this, but I've never had anyone stealth a disk on me.

And really if you've got a distraction, then you're better off just making a run for it anyway while the mercs are distracted instead of stealthily trying to get it there.

Stealthing a disk succeeds like 1 time in 10 at best. It's why 99% of people don't even bother using stealth and just make a blind run.

[Farley4Fan]

This is true.  I've tried to stealth a disc a lot of times.  BUT, to my dismay, it wasted time everytime I did it and it failed 4/5 times I tried it.  However, whenever I've got a distraction going (or a bomb planted), I succeed at rushing it 4/5 times.  It's just much more effective and wastes no time doing it.

[Westfall]

I admit its easier to just run the bad boy in there. I prefer stealth. The only reason its harder is because the 2 drop off points are too close to each other. Zed's map Sanctuary had the right idea with the disks. Balancing it out with sector type of objectives, but you could go after any 1 at any given time.

[Gawain]

stealthing the disk isn't a very valid option because of the bad placement of the disk dropoff zones and the lack of a slow climb move. how about fixing these problems first before considering any more changes?

[InvisibleMan999]

stealthing the disk isn't a very valid option because of the bad placement of the disk dropoff zones and the lack of a slow climb move. how about fixing these problems first before considering any more changes?

Part of it is bad dropoff placement, though the other part lies in the actual nature of the disk objective itself. Disk objectives tend to make maps smaller. This is because they're an objective that doesn't exist all the time, and the merc doesn't have to patrol the disk pick-up. So the real objective, the drop-off, only exists at certain periods of time and the spies have constraints on their speed to get there.

The only real advantage of a disk drop-off is that you can complete the objective fast when you get there.

And this whole setup just reeks of a pure aggro style system where you're expected to shock the merc and run to the drop-off. I mean, really, where's the incentive to go stealthy?

Now, you can play around with locations of drop-offs and pickups on maps, but I don't feel it'll make much of a difference. Disk missions are still going to be done best with a run-around or aggro style, and they'll still have the problem of making your level smaller. Orphanage is probably the only level I know that uses the disk well. It's still a run after you get it, but the challenge is more getting to the disk as opposed to getting away. That'd be a decent pattern to model, but I'm not sure how best to set that up.

And the answer to that I think lies in making that disk pick-up objective a bit more of a no brainer. If you don't know necessarily when a spy has a disk or not, then you may have to patrol the drop-off sometimes, just to make sure. It also rewards stealth because if they don't know you've got the disk. It becomes much tougher.

Alternately, we could just use the orphanage design model where disks are painfully easy to deliver, so you're forced to actually patrol pick-ups because you simply cannot stop a drop-off very well at all.