Tick Tock - Camo video

[Gawain]

i may be harsh, but quite frankly, i'm more reasonable than most of you.
with those drastic changes camo will play a totally different role ingame:
-you have to be in cover to activate it instead of shadows
-you can activate it right next to the merc without him knowing
-camping with camo get's a boost because it stays longer activated (i know that wasting time is bad anyways, but this takes a lot away from the timing part)
-with mt and emf getting that much weakened, camo and flashbangs will get a huge boost anyways, so you have to seriously nerf aggro capabilities of the spies or balance will totally shift towards the spy side

the new camo concept sounds fun for more dynamic and up-close use, but it won't fit in very well that way. if you wanna make it work, you should replace the visual effect with a sound similar to ct that can only be heard within 3-5meters (alarm snares should also make camo sound btw) and make the duration something like 15s-cv^-2 and play with c a lot till it feels right. the visibility should only be affected by lightning and distance, not by speed (except for running and falling). you should also play around with blour instead of optical fraction or a mixture of both (2142 camo <> ct camo).

now that i gave good reasons and some constructive roundup, please tell me: what exactly made you think that changing camo this way  was a good idea?

[VaNilla]

i may be harsh, but quite frankly, i'm more reasonable than most of you.
with those drastic changes camo will play a totally different role ingame:
-you have to be in cover to activate it instead of shadows
-you can activate it right next to the merc without him knowing
-camping with camo get's a boost because it stays longer activated (i know that wasting time is bad anyways, but this takes a lot away from the timing part)
-with mt and emf getting that much weakened, camo and flashbangs will get a huge boost anyways, so you have to seriously nerf aggro capabilities of the spies or balance will totally shift towards the spy side

First off, why would you activate camo in the shadows unless a merc wasn't around so that you could progress to another area? You can activate camo anywhere, it depends on the situation, you would have only activated camo in shadows for the same reason in CT if you have any sesne. Secondly, why would you activate a camo suit right next to the merc. Thirdly, you do not camp with camo, you use it to move ahead to your objective. Finally, how do you know exactly how the timing and gadgets are going to effect balance in a game you've never played? I think your clutching at straws here to be honest.

Correct. 1-2 seconds max. We'll figure out the time during playtests.

To be honest, if it were that you might as well not include it, it would be out almost directly after the visual effect :P.

[Bubbaganoosh]

I read alot here but don't post very often but reading this thread made me ill. I look at some of the comments people made here and can't beleive it. Some of you are already whining about balance and function and the game isn't even close to finished yet. These guys may get a new idea a month from now and change this. Hell it may change ten times before the game is finished. Be patient people, I'm sure it will be worth the wait.

Constructive critism never hurts but complaints and useless comments do nobody any good and you should keep them to yourself. To the one who said "Well, we could expect more after 3 months with no update." I suggest you do a project like this while you work, take care of your family and other life challenges and have something new to release every week or two. Yeah, likely won't happen.

I think the progress you guys are making is damn good considering this is a spare time thing. I started to make a map in UT3 and couldn't beleive how long it took to have almost nothing to show. You guys are making all the static meshes, animations and alot of textures from scratch aren't you? Not to mention all the sound and lighting issues for the maps and animations.

I think the camo looks pretty good and likely took a long time to get it to this point. Keep up the good work guys and I for one look forward to the next thing you have to show no matter when that is.

[Gawain]

stonecoldkilla: how about reading the whole thread before writing nonsense?

First off, why would you activate camo in the shadows unless a merc wasn't around so that you could progress to another area? You can activate camo anywhere, it depends on the situation, you would have only activated camo in shadows for the same reason in CT if you have any sesne.

when i want to move from one shadow to another crossing a light up area, that's when. in ct i can activate the camo in the shadow, and with this new camo "feature" i would have to do it behind cover. i dont't give a shit about the case that no merc is in the area because i wouldn't need camo in that case anyways.

Secondly, why would you activate a camo suit right next to the merc.

in ct i wouldn't, but with this new camo you could activate it 0.5m next to him without him hearing anything.

Thirdly, you do not camp with camo, you use it to move ahead to your objective.

exactly. so why would you wanna implement a mechanic like speed-dependant energy drain that helps camping for necks and makes moving to objectives harder?

Finally, how do you know exactly how the timing and gadgets are going to effect balance in a game you've never played?

it doesn't take a genious to understand that all those drastic changes will affect gameplay hugely. unless the team comes up with some really good arguments (which it didn't; looking "cool" is no point at all), i'm winning this argument.

bubbaganoosh: don't spam bullshit when all your saying is "good job team fuck criticism".

[AgentX_003]

stonecoldkilla: how about reading the whole thread before writing nonsense?

First off, why would you activate camo in the shadows unless a merc wasn't around so that you could progress to another area? You can activate camo anywhere, it depends on the situation, you would have only activated camo in shadows for the same reason in CT if you have any sesne.

when i want to move from one shadow to another crossing a light up area, that's when. in ct i can activate the camo in the shadow, and with this new camo "feature" i would have to do it behind cover. i dont't give a shit about the case that no merc is in the area because i wouldn't need camo in that case anyways.

Secondly, why would you activate a camo suit right next to the merc.

in ct i wouldn't, but with this new camo you could activate it 0.5m next to him without him hearing anything.

Thirdly, you do not camp with camo, you use it to move ahead to your objective.

exactly. so why would you wanna implement a mechanic like speed-dependant energy drain that helps camping for necks and makes moving to objectives harder?

Finally, how do you know exactly how the timing and gadgets are going to effect balance in a game you've never played?

it doesn't take a genious to understand that all those drastic changes will affect gameplay hugely. unless the team comes up with some really good arguments (which it didn't; looking "cool" is no point at all), i'm winning this argument.

bubbaganoosh: don't spam bullshit when all your saying is "good job team fuck criticism".

Rambo get off your high horse sir because honestly this kind of attitude just drives people away , so stop it ! .

[LennardF1989]

@STON3COLDKILLA: The 1-2 seconds frvge mentioned is the duration of the XMAS TREE Effect, not the actual camo usage time ;)

[Gawain]

i'd be okay with the idiotic "XMAS TREE Effect" if every downloader of ps gets a nice cookie parcel from mr.mic  ;D

[Zedblade]

I read alot here but don't post very often but reading this thread made me ill. I look at some of the comments people made here and can't beleive it. Some of you are already whining about balance and function and the game isn't even close to finished yet. These guys may get a new idea a month from now and change this. Hell it may change ten times before the game is finished. Be patient people, I'm sure it will be worth the wait.

Constructive critism never hurts but complaints and useless comments do nobody any good and you should keep them to yourself. To the one who said "Well, we could expect more after 3 months with no update." I suggest you do a project like this while you work, take care of your family and other life challenges and have something new to release every week or two. Yeah, likely won't happen.

I think the progress you guys are making is damn good considering this is a spare time thing. I started to make a map in UT3 and couldn't beleive how long it took to have almost nothing to show. You guys are making all the static meshes, animations and alot of textures from scratch aren't you? Not to mention all the sound and lighting issues for the maps and animations.

I think the camo looks pretty good and likely took a long time to get it to this point. Keep up the good work guys and I for one look forward to the next thing you have to show no matter when that is.

Post more often. I'm in love with you.

Anyway, Rambo, your biggest problem is that you are still set in a CT mindset and are trying to incorporate the camo changes into established Ct gameplay. STOP! That is not how it works. PS is going to play very much like Ct, but at the same time very differently. CT and DA had the same concept and they are completely different MPs. Think the same with PS... accept PS won't be as horrible and water downed as the DA MP...

I hope... :P

[LennardF1989]

I read alot here but don't post very often but reading this thread made me ill. I look at some of the comments people made here and can't beleive it. Some of you are already whining about balance and function and the game isn't even close to finished yet. These guys may get a new idea a month from now and change this. Hell it may change ten times before the game is finished. Be patient people, I'm sure it will be worth the wait.

Constructive critism never hurts but complaints and useless comments do nobody any good and you should keep them to yourself. To the one who said "Well, we could expect more after 3 months with no update." I suggest you do a project like this while you work, take care of your family and other life challenges and have something new to release every week or two. Yeah, likely won't happen.

I think the progress you guys are making is damn good considering this is a spare time thing. I started to make a map in UT3 and couldn't beleive how long it took to have almost nothing to show. You guys are making all the static meshes, animations and alot of textures from scratch aren't you? Not to mention all the sound and lighting issues for the maps and animations.

I think the camo looks pretty good and likely took a long time to get it to this point. Keep up the good work guys and I for one look forward to the next thing you have to show no matter when that is.

Have my babies ;D

[Gawain]

zed, i have no problem with changes that make sense. so far the only reason for that change i've heard is that it looks cool.

[LennardF1989]

Do we need a reason to implement something cool looking? Heck, if the team wants a bazooka for the spy, we'll get a bazooka for the spy, without reasoning :P

[MR.Mic]

We're simply trading an audio cue, which is 360 degrees and notifies the mercs even behind walls with a visual cue which is only 90 degrees, and doesn't notifiy the merc through walls.

[Westfall]

We're simply trading an audio cue, which is 360 degrees and notifies the mercs even behind walls with a visual cue which is only 90 degrees, and doesn't notifiy the merc through walls.

Well put. I'm glad Mic had to come in here and clear something up that was already stated. It balanced itself out Rambo. If you still don't understand it, then stay in CT land forever plz....wait...already happening it seems.

I think the camo looks great. It will also server a far better purpose than that of CT's garbage camo.

[Roberto1223]

at first i didnt like it but its good to try new things so cool.

[Zedblade]

zed, i have no problem with changes that make sense. so far the only reason for that change i've heard is that it looks cool.

that was stated once as a joke, and we have said the real reason for the change tons of times throughout the 5 pages of this thread. For some reason, you are choosing to ignore them.