equipment amount decrease every respawn (and related stuff like mask)

[I <3 U]

I think we should have ammo refill boxes, but they should have a limit. Instead of acting like an unlimited ammo refill, the box should loose a "refill point" each time it's used (this will also make mercs look for other boxes, in case one runs out of ammo).

Good idea, would this include gadgets aswell? I think it should :).

[LennardF1989]

I think we should have ammo refill boxes, but they should have a limit. Instead of acting like an unlimited ammo refill, the box should loose a "refill point" each time it's used (this will also make mercs look for other boxes, in case one runs out of ammo).

Good idea, would this include gadgets aswell? I think it should :).

We should have seperate boxes for each team then. It would be a little odd if spies could get stuff supplied by the merc his "hirer". If I were to hire mercs, I would make sure that box doesn't contain anything useful for the enemy.

[Gawain]

why don't you like the idea?

It may be awesome for people that aggro a lot (as some sort of protection, aggro checks maybe?), but it would suck for people playing seriously trying to counter the merc as less as possible (seeing it from the spy side).

are u on drugs? did you even bother to read my suggestion properly? the whole point of it is to give careful players more nades so that they don't get a disadvantage by running out of stuff mid-game and to cut away eq for uncareful aggro players that die a lot. seriously, don't post toal bullshit.

besides not showing your pure ignorance in that attitude, i'd also like you not to spam this thread with the refill box stuff unless you have a proper idea how it should work.

[LennardF1989]

Actually, we both misread eachother.

I'm against the die = lose equipment, unless you clearly aggroed (thus rewarding stealthy careful people). Meaning if you died in an aggro attack or aggroed most of the time, you'll get a "gadget fine" so to speak. Though, I still think this should be defined by the server host, like an option to enable "Aggro fines".

And I just replied to FR33M4N regarding the boxes. It would be great to have them at some points, I just additionally said that:
1. A box should run out of ammo, thus forcing mercs or spies to get their refills somewhere else in the map.
2. Spies should get their own ammo box somewhere in the map, because it would be odd if you could grab stuff from a mercs box as a spy (why would a merc have sound emmiters or sticky camera's in the ammo box anyway?).

No need to get pissy about it, we just had a misunderstanding... Judging from your first post, I obviously didn't understood/couldn't make out it should only affect aggro players.

EDIT:
Note that most mapped stuff is variable, meaning an ammo box can hold a different amount of ammo depending on each map and/or location in a map.

[Gawain]

i'm not for limiting the playing style, i just can't see why someone playing carefully and not dying should run out of equipment while someone dying 4 times gets 4 times the amount of equipment and can continue spamming.
placing refill boxes would be quite a drastic change in gameplay and the map design would have to focus around that fact pretty heavily. my suggestion is way less complicated and solves the same problem.

[Westfall]

i'm not for limiting the playing style, i just can't see why someone playing carefully and not dying should run out of equipment while someone dying 4 times gets 4 times the amount of equipment and can continue spamming.
placing refill boxes would be quite a drastic change in gameplay and the map design would have to focus around that fact pretty heavily. my suggestion is way less complicated and solves the same problem.

Because thats what respawning is. If you're going to go the "gadget loss route", then players should start with gadgets and as they die remain with whatever gadgets they had when they died. The way to refill it would be the ammo boxes.

And no, your suggestion doesn't solve any problem(s). I agree with Leonard...if I saw a room where things were changed up, I would leave. If a player dies quickly, or uses everything and dies quickly, they should neither be punished nor rewarded for using gadgets. How does that make sense? If anything, it would make gameplay sloppy because mercs would know if spies had limited amount of eq and vice versa. Keeping a constant helps the game to have depth. If you want to change it, it should be an option....but not different amounts of gadgets pending time of death or use of eq during time of death. Your suggestion has no relation to balance. Its a manipulation of the regular settings which should apply for all games.

[frvge]

Because thats what respawning is. If you're going to go the "gadget loss route", then players should start with gadgets and as they die remain with whatever gadgets they had when they died. The way to refill it would be the ammo boxes.

Interesting idea

[I <3 U]

If you're going to go the "gadget loss route", then players should start with gadgets and as they die remain with whatever gadgets they had when they died. The way to refill it would be the ammo boxes.

This is a better idea than mine and rambos.

Atleast it wouldn't punish you for dying more than you already are. If one merc is dead, the spies will in most cases complete and objective. It would add a whole new element to gameplay aswell. Players would more regularly take ammo/gadget refills because they fear they are going to die, it would save them time.

[Gawain]

westfall, you make no argument at all besides your personal preference.

i had quite a long talk with mr.mic yesterday witch lead me to these thoughts:
-the tactical decision to kill or to knock out a merc (buy more time and face new eq or buy less and let him run out) should stay in the game; same goes for suiciding/teamkilling in the right moment
-the position you infiltrated to on the map makes up for some lack of equipment (cause you need time and probably some eq to get to that position again from the spawn point), but this balance factor heavily relies on map design (for instance, compare factory and steel)
-it makes absolutely no sense that every gadget amount is set to 5 (or 4 on the merc side). 5 is a good number for nades, but certainly not for snares, bullets etc
-making mask a permanent gadget makes perfect sense, but would probably require to give the mercs only 3 free slots

i still think that the necessity to die to not run out of eq is totally stupid, so there must be either a possibility to refill gadgets on the map or something similar to the system i suggested.

If you're going to go the "gadget loss route", then players should start with gadgets and as they die remain with whatever gadgets they had when they died. The way to refill it would be the ammo boxes.

NOW we're making some progress.
i don't like the idea of mercs and spies sharing the same ammo box cause it makes absolutely no sense, but your idea is a nice synthesis overall. it could even be combinded with an inventory-style idea of kurbutti.

it could work like this:
-if you die you respawn with the exact same amount of eq you had left when dying
-you can refill your eq at ammonition boxes placed rather far away from objectives
-every ammunition box holds a certain inventory that can run out
-mercs carry only 3 nades etc so that backpack is still useful

[I <3 U]

So is this what we want:

- The ability for merc and spies to refill their gadgets from ammo boxes. Mercs and spies should not use the same ammo box.

- When killed, you respawn with the same amount of equipment / gadgets that you had before dying.

- There to be a limit on how many times you can refill from the ammo boxes (the ammo boxes run out of equipment). But this should be different for all ammo boxes, depending on the location of the box (for example an ammo box right next to an objective, should maybe allow 1-2 refills, whereas a box that draws mercs from positions they have to cover allow 3-6 refills).

My only question is where would you put the spy refill boxes?

In spawn?

Places which would force spies to reveal themselves?

[Kurbutti]

My only question is where would you put the spy refill boxes?

In spawn?

Places which would force spies to reveal themselves?

They should be at least out of sight, in spy-only areas but not necessarily fully safe from grenades.

There should also be a visual objective-like HUD indication on the location of that box. The icon should change colour depending on how much stuff is still left, and it shows only for the selected gadget.  Green, whenever it can provide a full resupply, yellow when it can't and red when empty. This system can apply for both spies and mercs, because it provides the relevant information quickly and you don't have to waste time playing with the binocs or any other funny inventory tool.

EDIT: Here's a question: Should there be a sound assiciated with the spy refill? Not necessary something that causes the reticle to ping, but something unique enough so that mercs will know when a spy refills their equipment if they happen to be near enough.

[I <3 U]

My only question is where would you put the spy refill boxes?

In spawn?

Places which would force spies to reveal themselves?

EDIT: Here's a question: Should there be a sound assiciated with the spy refill? Not necessary something that causes the reticle to ping, but something unique enough so that mercs will know when a spy refills their equipment if they happen to be near enough.

Oh god YES!

[Gawain]

i still think that the 7 - 2/respawn system is superior (for the spy side).

[I <3 U]

i still think that the 7 - 2/respawn system is superior (for the spy side).

But spies don't kill each other for EQ...

[Succubus Dryad Of The Undying Comet]

But it does what it's supposed to: it punishes dying.