OMG where's the new stuff?

[NeoSuperior]

Well not necesarily alway ko the merc, let's say a 5% chance you'll ko him when you hit him?

NEVER things like "there is a X% chance that something works"... this game is not roulette :P

How about a suspended neck snap like in chaos theory singleplayer?

same concern as Cronky, but if that "behind door grab"-problem can be fixed, there is nothing in the way for it IMO.

Another thing I've been thinking about: Keycodes

Interesting, however i still prefer the way it was in SC:CT Versus...

[ghinsu]

You know those little vent things on aquarius that the mercs must blow up in order for spies to pass through them?
Well how about this: The spies can pick those things up, enter the vent, and put them back in place, this way it'll add more to the stealth bit :D

Also about spy coop moves, how about rope moves? Like, there is a really high wall and you can't possibly survive the fall, you could coop with your friend to lower you down with a rope, and/or lower the rope down for you.

[Cronky]

Vents: I think the point of those covered vents is to limit (and eventually open up) areas of the map. Not just there for spies to be sneaky. If the spies could get through them from the beginning, then the point that Mercs could blow them off would mean nothing. Might as well just not have a vent cover in the first place.

Rope Co-Op: Interesting idea if only because it reminds me of the co-op portions of CT where you would guide your spy partner down a long shaft (teehee). The use would be VERY limited though (as it was in Co-op) as most levels didn't have spots high enough that you would die if you jumped. ...Unless of course you didn't have health to begin with, in which case why are you jumping?

If levels were built with the idea in mind then it might work out in interesting ways. I can almost guarantee though that every time this idea would be used, it would always be used as a means to lower your teammate into an area at the beginning of a level, in the spy spawn. Just because the move takes so long (using CT as an example) that it would be impractical to use in an area where a Merc could be present. They'd just shoot your head off, potentially killing you both.

If the mercenaries fail and are killed, the security system goes into a lockdown mode to protect itself and the doors are locked for a period of time.  Something like that.

I assume by "Lockdown" you just mean that the spies wouldn't be able to open the doors, there would be no alarms or etc, and the remaining Merc would still have door abilities. It would be ridiculous if every time a Merc died an alarm went off.

Other than that though I think if it was limited to KO only, then that would be a pretty sweet plus for it. I still think that dragging a Merc to the door should still work to open it.

Random other thought, if we still get to "Hack" the communications of a Spy or Merc that is in our arms then it should just be a button press, and not a press and hold like on CT. A fun bit of that ability was that it cut communications with their partner. Un-fun part was having to hold the button to do so. Very minor, but there it is.

[DreadStunLock]

Ghinsu, you need to download UDK, and learn all the stuff there is about kismet, because most of the stuff you just said are possible to do, it's all up to the mapper.

Even the vent things, all you do, is just tell Kismet to open the vents when a spy gets close to them, and close after 3 seconds.

And also, PS will not feature Aquarius.

[NeoSuperior]

PT maps were remade... why not CT too?

I don't think they just copied everything 1:1 from PT to CT, because that would have been a legal issue.

[ghinsu]

Ghinsu, you need to download UDK, and learn all the stuff there is about kismet, because most of the stuff you just said are possible to do, it's all up to the mapper.

Even the vent things, all you do, is just tell Kismet to open the vents when a spy gets close to them, and close after 3 seconds.

And also, PS will not feature Aquarius.

I'm too lazy to learn that and will be too busy in about 2 months anyway xD I'm just shouting out ideas, who knows, maybe one of them is actually good :D

Here's an idea: Sabotage

So you know how in other maps in scct there are merc ammo cans, how about the ability for the spies to empty them?

Or when you ko a merc, you unload his gun (because, seriously, who the hell would ko a person and not take away his weapons/ammo? I mean, that would be unfair in a game, but at least unload the current clip, making it necessary for the merc to reload)

[DreadStunLock]

Frvge, allow spies to instead of elbow hit, allow the spies to take out the pins from the grenade and push them away, better yet give them Star Wars: Force Unleashed Force Push for even more dramatic effect, or Conviction style Krav Maga 1 button kill :P

[Farley4Fan]

If the mercenaries fail and are killed, the security system goes into a lockdown mode to protect itself and the doors are locked for a period of time.  Something like that.

I assume by "Lockdown" you just mean that the spies wouldn't be able to open the doors, there would be no alarms or etc, and the remaining Merc would still have door abilities. It would be ridiculous if every time a Merc died an alarm went off.

Other than that though I think if it was limited to KO only, then that would be a pretty sweet plus for it. I still think that dragging a Merc to the door should still work to open it.

Random other thought, if we still get to "Hack" the communications of a Spy or Merc that is in our arms then it should just be a button press, and not a press and hold like on CT. A fun bit of that ability was that it cut communications with their partner. Un-fun part was having to hold the button to do so. Very minor, but there it is.

Yeah that's what I was thinking.  I don't think there should be an audible alarm or anything when the merc dies, the door just won't open for spies.  Doesn't have to be too elaborate, right?  Each merc gets a separate random code generator or some shizz idk.  The bells and whistles dont have to be to fancy.  Once everyone gets past the pageantry, story behind it, and espionage style, it will just be gameplay that people really care about.  No one will really wonder why you only get it after KO'ing a merc - especially if there is some kind of quick semi-plausible explanation in the tutorial.

I agree with dragging and using the merc as a human keycard, if you're close enough it may be easier anyway.  Plus, it is ultimate humiliation.  Why not make the merc's pants drop to further the embarrassment?!

The hack com's feature better be included.  That one feature alone provided some of my best moments and memories for SvM.  Im all for something that makes it easier to perform.

Another idea I'm just going to throw out there regarding keycodes: maybe make them obtainable with the (wait for it)..... Hack Glove!  I know it has been discussed to death already, and I don't even remember what the community's verdict was, but if we can hack mercs like in DA we should be able to steal the keycodes to get into restricted doors.  This may make it worth implementing as a gadget instead of an alternative to the ss.

[NeoSuperior]

Frvge, allow spies to instead of elbow hit, allow the spies to take out the pins from the grenade and push them away, better yet give them Star Wars: Force Unleashed Force Push for even more dramatic effect, or Conviction style Krav Maga 1 button kill :P

ok... but to balance it out give mercs light sabers to block the "1 shoot kills" and to have more effective melee ablity, but also give them "forcejump" so they can get into spy spawn and make a bloodbath.

[DreadStunLock]

And spies get to Force Grip the Disks and throw them into the suitcase :P

[NeoSuperior]

Problem, Devs?

[Cronky]

Yeah that's what I was thinking.  I don't think there should be an audible alarm or anything when the merc dies, the door just won't open for spies.  Doesn't have to be too elaborate, right?  Each merc gets a separate random code generator or some shizz idk.  The bells and whistles dont have to be to fancy.  Once everyone gets past the pageantry, story behind it, and espionage style, it will just be gameplay that people really care about.  No one will really wonder why you only get it after KO'ing a merc - especially if there is some kind of quick semi-plausible explanation in the tutorial.

Okay good! We were on the same page. The explanation is simple enough to ingest without sounding too ridiculous. Something about getting up after a KO would have to be a reason why the security changes (more on that later though). You're right that after the initial "Oh, that's why? Okay" situation boils over, people will just focus on the gameplay aspect of it. I do still like that it could give another pro to KOs.

I agree with dragging and using the merc as a human keycard, if you're close enough it may be easier anyway.  Plus, it is ultimate humiliation.  Why not make the merc's pants drop to further the embarrassment?!

I like where this is going! Bring back the ability to draw penises on the Merc's visor and I think this idea works perfect. (Perhaps you just hack their helmet and have digital penises fill the Merc's screen.)

The hack com's feature better be included.  That one feature alone provided some of my best moments and memories for SvM.  Im all for something that makes it easier to perform.

Woooo! Me too!

Another idea I'm just going to throw out there regarding keycodes: maybe make them obtainable with the (wait for it)..... Hack Glove!  I know it has been discussed to death already, and I don't even remember what the community's verdict was, but if we can hack mercs like in DA we should be able to steal the keycodes to get into restricted doors.  This may make it worth implementing as a gadget instead of an alternative to the ss.

A long distance keycode grabber? I'd have to assume it would be much like DA in that the Mercs can tell when someone is using it on them, but the plus side of it could be that you will get a max amount of keycode have-age before the security resets itself. So while KO-ing a Merc may only give you a small window to open restricted doors, the hack glove (after appropriate amounts of hacking) would give you like... double.

[Farley4Fan]

Okay good! We were on the same page. The explanation is simple enough to ingest without sounding too ridiculous. Something about getting up after a KO would have to be a reason why the security changes (more on that later though). You're right that after the initial "Oh, that's why? Okay" situation boils over, people will just focus on the gameplay aspect of it. I do still like that it could give another pro to KOs.

Something I'm thinking is that they could explain it with the actual animations.  With a neckbreak, the spy needs two hands.  With a knockout (currently), the spy uses his right elbow in the neck/shoulder area and has his left hand free to roam around the merc's body (hawt lol).  I'm thinking that while knocking the merc out with his right elbow, the spy could also just grab an actual keycard type thing off of the merc's vest with his left hand.  I think it would require less work.  It may cause some people to be like HEY WHY CANNOT I GRABBA DA KEECARD LIKE DAT AT ALL DA TIMEZ?  But it will look good, kind of be explained, and it will only need a slight mention or video in the tutorial to get the point across.

I like where this is going! Bring back the ability to draw penises on the Merc's visor and I think this idea works perfect. (Perhaps you just hack their helmet and have digital penises fill the Merc's screen.)

Bring it back? As if it went anywhere at all!  You know the devs have secretly already implemented it for themselves as a secret dev-only humiliation technique.  I've paid them good money to have the screen read "FarleyWuzHere!" in the center of the merc's screen.

The hack com's feature better be included.  That one feature alone provided some of my best moments and memories for SvM.  Im all for something that makes it easier to perform.

Woooo! Me too!

Something I feel I can say confidently (w/o Agent and the crew jumping all over me) is that one thing the xbox version does better is the hacking com's feature.  Everyone uses the same chat channel.  If you get 4 cocky people playing for realsies and talking ish, there is no better feeling than to tag one with a spy bullet and listen to them slowly start to panic as you hack away.  There has to be some kind of incentive for using Project Stealth's actual chat channel if we want the chat hacking feature to make an impact at all.

A long distance keycode grabber? I'd have to assume it would be much like DA in that the Mercs can tell when someone is using it on them, but the plus side of it could be that you will get a max amount of keycode have-age before the security resets itself. So while KO-ing a Merc may only give you a small window to open restricted doors, the hack glove (after appropriate amounts of hacking) would give you like... double.

I like where you're going with this.  It seems like there are a lot of variables to tweak, and that gives you more options in terms of actually balancing it.  Do you think this idea alone could be enough to resurrect the hack glove idea?  At the length it has been discussed and buried, I doubt it.  However, it's still kind of interesting to me.

[Cronky]

Too much work would go into breaking that quote up so I'll just reply without it!

KO IDEA:
It would be sweet to have a nice little animation that explains HOW this idea gets done. I assume that a physical keycard wouldn't be taken, mainly because there is the minor detail of how the Merc gets another card that's left out. Instead, much like how doors are activated by proximity anyway, the Spy would just steal the code off of the card. Kinda like one of those Visa "Tap and Go" deals. The Spy would simply need to tap wherever the keycard is on the Merc and then game logic explains everything else.

Game logic also explaining why they couldn't do that with a neck break (though then again, we did already explain that the code lockdown is triggered by the Merc's Vitals, or rather lack there of).

IN GAME CHAT:
Using the in-game chat was definitely more prevalent in the Xbox version. That seems to be my biggest miff with PS (and Ubisoft SvM in general) for PC. Hacking the Coms for either team was by faaar my favorite part of any gadget (Followed closely by PT's Phosphorus Grenade). Not only was it sweet to sometimes overhear something vital, but it was equally as fun trying to trip up the other team that you knew was listening in (both in a legit way, and just by talking about outrageous, off topic things).

It sounds like it's going to be hard to figure out a way to make everyone use the In-Game chat when other third party software is so close at hand (and frequently used). I'd hope there is some way to force it, but it sounds unlikely. If they can get the voice quality as good as Xfire/Steam/Vent/Teamspeak/etc. then I guess there would be more of an incentive to not NEED to jump through an extra hoop while playing the game (opening up on of the programs mentioned before).

HACKING GLOVE:
Adding in that ability might make it more useful, but it doesn't seem like it would do much to change peoples opinions. Though the hacking glove never got a stern "NO!" in any of the topics I remember reading a while back. I can already hear Frvge saying, "Sounds like a good idea of PS 2(.0). It wont be in PS 1(.0) though".

[Farley4Fan]

I hadn't thought of the fact that if the spy takes the card, then the merc will not have one.  Seems pretty important unless we think it's plausible that a merc has a pocket full of infinite keycards generating random codes lolz

To tip toe around this impossibility, I like your suggestion of the tap 'n' go.  The spy puts his little wrist computer thing over an area and quickly scans for the code.  I think it was called an opsat or something in splinter cell.  The spy knocks out the merc and gets a little beep on his wrist comp.

Possibly make a 3rd option when you have a merc.  Neck break, knockout, or 'scan and knockout'.  This would let the devs create a longer, more plausible animation (with the scan and the knockout) for gameplay and explanation reasons.  Maybe the spy would knock out the merc first, and then the spy would hold the knocked out/limp body while scanning for the code to the door. 

With this option you have risk/reward: hold onto the merc for a bit longer to get a code but risk being killed by his teammate.  But the problem is that now we are getting back to square one where we might as well just drag the merc to the door and even kill him.  I'm thinking, though, that the tap n go idea would work here and make the animation only a second or so longer.

Beta.  Now.

I agree with your other responses.