i am an atheist

[Tidenburg]

Of course everything has scientific strings attached to it you fool. If we discovered god was real, or that random lollipops float through space science would still be attached to it because science is essentially the general study of how our universe is built up. A black hole is matter collapsed in on itself onto its own source of gravity, the 'mystical' thing is what happens when you go inside it. As we already know the further away from gravity you are, the slower time progresses, so theoretically you would reach a point where for the person inside the hole, time would appear frozen. My guess is that you are then just crushes into the tiniest measurement possible (exaggeration here, of course), but of course then there's the question of where it all goes.

While we're on the topic of gravity. Who likes the idea that gravity bends space itself rather than pulling objects directly in?

[Farley4Fan]

Papa,

Multiple times the bible states that God picks and chooses who goes to heaven, not based on your faith. Are we predetermined to go to hell? Do we never get a chance? Or is religion the way to believe that when you die, something happens?

No, we are not predetermined.  FREE WILL.  We have it, we can do whatever we wish.  It's what we do with that free will that ultimately God will use to make the decision.  I don't think that you HAVE to be a follower of the church to get into heaven, and I also don't believe that if you are a follower of the church then you WILL get into heaven.  It's all based on our actions.  If you were raised atheist, agnostic, islamic, whatever - I'm sure God has sympathy and will judge you not by your faith or lack thereof but by how you lived your life.  Say you grew up in Africa, or an island, somewhere where you will never hear of Christianity, it does not mean you go to hell.  Goes back to what I just said.

Religion was thought up when times were bad. They formed hope. Nothing else. Besides, how many stories about adam and eve could there really be?

Depends on interpertations.  Adam/Eve could be anything.  Not just a true story of the origin of man, but a story to inspire morals. 

1. Creates adam and eve at the same time. Genesis 1:27 "So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them."

2. Creates Adam, from dust mind you, and Adam fucks around for a while. Then he takes a rib and makes Eve.

I'm guessing you watched the penn and teller thing.  The Bible is not a history book and cannot be used as one simply because of the multiple interperetations.  It's more of a symbol.  There are various truths and things found in the bible that have but one interpertation, these things I believe to have more truth than others found in it.  Such as, the story of Jesus.  Think of this.  Suppose there is a God, is it hard to believe that this God had sent a messenger at one point?  A messenger he called his son?  A messenger to do his best to spread the word of this God and to bring hope/morality to a troubled world?  This is why I stick mostly to God and Jesus for truth, and most of the rest are exaggerated truths with various interpertations, but bring about the same message and morals whatever way you interperet those stories.  I think this is how it was intended to be.

More odd shit...

Light was created BEFORE the sun existed. That just doesn't happen! Even then, plants were created before the sun, which leads to no photosynthesis.

Remember that God has no care of time or petty human physics.  Because of this, the seven days he created our universe could mean any amount of time and not 7 days of 24 hours.  7 days of a billion years maybe, who knows?  God was before humans, so would not use the precise human measurement of a day to record how long it took.  We aren't in the position to know how he created things completely.  How odd would it be if God created "nature"?  What if God took 7 "days" to design the creation of the universe?  Say God was the one that clumped all this matter together and placed everything so perfectly that the Big Bang resulted in us and countless other beauties.  Say God was the one who designed and intended evolution to happen "naturally" to eventually result in humans when the time was right?  Who can really say what is natural?  Who can really say how exactly God created us?  Who can really say that God would not use methods that are (what we percieve as) just natural phenomenon?  We can only imagine at this point.

Isiah 40:28 "Hast thou not known? hast thou not heard, that the everlasting God, the Lord, the Creator of the ends of the earth, fainteth not, neither is he weary?"
Exodus 31:17 "For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed."
Hmm.... He is tired, but is never tired. Doesn't happen often.

If God is almighty, why does he not stop evil? If he can and won't, he is a douche bag. If he would but he can't, he is not omnipotent. If he can't do either, what qualifies him as a god?

God is a douche bag because he gives humans (and all other animals for that matter) free will?  Not his fault that people decide to do evil things.  If God stopped evil, we'd practically already be in heaven.  Evil will be eventually dealt with in the right way and the righteous will as well.

If God is almighty, can he make something so heavy that even he can't lift? PLEASE ANSWER THIS.

My guess to this attempted trap of a question is that no, he cannot.  He could make something infinitely big, or infinitely small, but the size won't matter.


And Ion, God isn't just a strong brute in the clouds lifting billion lb. weights until all his creations are dead.  A spirtual being.  A designer.

[Blank Man]

Of course everything has scientific strings attached to it you fool. If we discovered god was real, or that random lollipops float through space science would still be attached to it because science is essentially the general study of how our universe is built up. A black hole is matter collapsed in on itself onto its own source of gravity, the 'mystical' thing is what happens when you go inside it. As we already know the further away from gravity you are, the slower time progresses, so theoretically you would reach a point where for the person inside the hole, time would appear frozen. My guess is that you are then just crushes into the tiniest measurement possible (exaggeration here, of course), but of course then there's the question of where it all goes.

While we're on the topic of gravity. Who likes the idea that gravity bends space itself rather than pulling objects directly in?

Explain to me what lies behind the "never ending" universe then, my all knowing smart fuck.

[LennardF1989]

FFS, let this topic rest already. It's going nowhere and never will be somewhere, it's like dicussions about wheter abortion is right or not, it depends on the people and their way of thinking.

Let everyone believe what he wants to and life your live.

END

[Farley4Fan]

Life your live?

lol

And my post didn't get registered I was trying to tell Blank Man to cool his jets.

[Westfall]

FFS, let this topic rest already. It's going nowhere and never will be somewhere, it's like dicussions about wheter abortion is right or not, it depends on the people and their way of thinking.

Let everyone believe what he wants to and life your live.

END

That's the point of this section of the forum, to talk about stuff. If you can't handle it, simply walk away. This has been a good discussionso far with many viewpoints. I say, keep it coming.

[Blank Man]

We're not finished untill Tidenburg explains his answer to my question in a way that makes sense. And sinse he can't... fin

[Tidenburg]

Err, just because we don't understand it or can't grasp it in our minds it doesn't mean it doesn't have 'scientific strings attached'. The reality is we'll never know what's out there because it's constantly expanding, but either way, whatever is past the boundaries of our universe must still have a scientific explanation. ;)

ie just because you can't explain it it doesn't mean it's not scientific because if it wasn't science wouldn't try to investigate into it.

[Farley4Fan]

The reality is we'll never know what's out there because it's constantly expanding, but either way, whatever is past the boundaries of our universe must still have a scientific explanation.

This right here.  This is flawed.  We only know the scientific laws of OUR universe.  Anything beyond that is up to the imagination.  I personally believe, beyond our universe, is the domain of OUR universe's designer.  But that's just my speculation and it's what I believe to be true, I can't prove that to you though.  You cannot tell me definitively that OUR science works even past our universe, you can't prove it anyway. 

And who said that our universe is God?  Westfall?  Anyway, interesting.  What if that were swopped and God were the universe and all actions (such as nature or laws of physics) stemmed from him.  What if God created the universe, and took up a consiousness inside of all of it?  Thus giving him all power and knowledge.

[Ion.67]

In response to Papa's response to my post:

In reality, I watched it a long ass time ago. Back when I was a Christian. I thought it was ridiculous. But, as I questioned more and more, I found the Skeptics Annotated Bible. It is nice :P. I have the bible on my Itouch for me to read through when I am bored, so it isn't like I just search around for this stuff.

The fact that a good majority of the world lives their entire lives based on a book is bad enough. Let alone that the book has a huge amount of contradictions.

2 Thessalonians 2:16 "God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned."
What a cock! Why would he do such a thing? To test us? Can we be blamed for believing such a strong delusion? Especially when god sent it! If we don't follow this delusion, maybe we aren't smart enough to go to heaven.

Loopholes in the bible: I am an atheist. Should you: Kill me, shun me, or love me? All three are in the bible. Love thy neighbor. Since I am your neighbor, but an atheist, should I be loved or killed?

Ephesians 1 1:4-5 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will"
Hmm, I'm sure that says that we are predestined.

Anyway, God is omniscient...right? That means God is lacking in the free will area. He can see the future, meaning he can't choose it. It has been predestined for him to be able to even see it, meaning that there is no way he can choose anything differently. Either way, God shouldn't have free will. he should always choose the most moral and good choice, correct? Well, what about stopping war? What makes it right for millions of families, Christian families, to have to suffer?! Is it serving a greater cause? To populate heaven maybe?

Why do we have free will? The future has no been planned, there is no god, and we can choose to do whatever the hell we want.

In the Bible, God kills so many people, and for what reason? Because they didn't do as he told. At one point he even wipes out a third of the world. Like holy cow man! Even Hitler didn't accomplish that!

[Tidenburg]

Papa, quite the contrary, I believe OUR science is non-existant outside our universe, I believe there are other universes past our boundaries with completely different laws, (I would say laws of physics but even that wouldn't exist).

[Westfall]

Papa, quite the contrary, I believe OUR science is non-existant outside our universe, I believe there are other universes past our boundaries with completely different laws, (I would say laws of physics but even that wouldn't exist).

Do you think there are laws undiscovered in this universe? Do you think these other universes have yet to discover our laws? Do you think other universes are beyond us with more complex laws?

[I <3 U]

Our planet will melt due to global warming before we find anything.

[Westfall]

Our planet is not going to melt....we've used too much of our earth's resources and emitted too much into the atmosphere. It's happened before, and a super volcano was the cause. Takes everything in the earth and shoots it out, creating a cloud around the earth causing an ice age. When the cloud settles, the earth can do what its supposed to and restore itself...until something new comes a long and starts eating at it.

I will say it's too late to change what the past generations have done to our planet. Get ready for the ride. If you're on the coast...move to higher locations or inland...Personally, I live on the east coast of the U.S....not looking forward to what's to come if we don't think of something.

[AgentX_003]

Our planet will melt due to global warming before we find anything.

your dumb freeman, the planet wont Melt, the ice caps however are melting as we speak and that = Global flooding =/


Dr.Evil is a prophecy, He predicted this in the movie GoldMember:

"The Tractor beam code name preparation H , powerful enough to pull the meteor Midas 22 to the earths atmosphere ,the hot ball of magma will strike and melt the polar ice caps causing a global flood "

which is kinda the effect global warming is doing at the moment .