A slowing gadget

[InvisibleMan999]

The ideal slowing effect would be something you set up before hand. For instance say you're in river mall and have the spy hacking the showroom. You fire a slow nade to the back exit of showroom and go in the main way. If the spy chooses to go out the back, he gets slowed and you probably catch him. If he chooses to go out the front he has to contend with you.

The slow nade should be a way to temporarily cut off a spy's escape route.

[Gawain]

there's no need for a trap wire, sticky cams are sufficient for that purpose. on the other hand, ph. nades add something totally new to the gameplay: a possibility to quickly block a way with a tracking system and a slow down tool. besides, you can use them as fake nades.
it looks to me like the devs like the idea of ph nades, so if you implement them please make them  explode at contact with walls etc (not like frag nades with a delay).

[Farley4Fan]

I've already stated why sticky cams aren't sufficient for that purpose:

1) You don't have to "man" the trip wire, it stops the merc without you having to look through it like the sticky cam.

2) Because of reason 1 you can still hack and have sufficient means of slowing the merc down.  With sticky cams you cannot.

3) Stickies can easily be countered by using gas mask.  The only way you can avoid a trip wire is if you see it and react quick enough to jump over it/shoot it.  Because they are only a few inches from the ground they are hard to see.

Gawain if you make it so that they explode on impact there will be no way of countering them or avoiding them as spies.  You basically get an insta nade everytime, which is bad.  The spies are just hit with it out of nowhere and all of sudden have no advantage over the merc.  Whereas if the grenade is on a timer (3 sec) the spies have time to react and avoid it. 

Maybe a lowered timer for phosphorous nades though?  Like half the time at 1.5-2 second delay?  OR it could start to shoot out the phosphorous nades as soon as it is launched but it takes time to fill out into a big cloud.  That to me sounds best.

[Gawain]

well insta ph nades arent op because they don't kill the spy, they just help the merc a little bit to catch the fleeing spy. once again, if you have this problem let your mate cover you and get away 3s earlier.

[frvge]

What as a counter-gadget some adrenaline function for the Spies which boosts their speed and normal vision? (think some sort of special vision that automatically gets triggered instead of normal or any other Spy vision, showing Mercs and mines/traps)? Would last 3-5 seconds and you'd get 2 or 3 per life, also maybe boosts the Spy's health with 20% (or acts like armor).

[Farley4Fan]

Eh, nah.  I hate having gadgets that only counter other specific gadgets.  I understand it may be useful for other things though...

Gawain, why would you want to get away 3s earlier if you could hack 4s longer?

[Spekkio]

What as a counter-gadget some adrenaline function

No, hard-counter gadgets = bad.

What I'm thinking is the slowing gadget slows the spies to the merc's run speed, and removes the speed bonus from diving.

There are several ways this can be put into the game:

-A passive defense that could work either like a spy trap, proxy mine, or PD that shoots something that slows you to the merc's speed for a short period of time (figure like 10 seconds) when you trip it.
-A grenade that leaves a cloud
-A grenade that explodes on contact
-A direct shot device that you aim and shoot with your gun, maybe like a netting or some goo or something

When I was thinking of this, I was more thinking of a direct-shot device, since it would be most useful when you are actually chasing the spy. The passive trap would be my last choice because the utility of the gadget comes from when you have already spotted the spy. If he trips the defense when you're not around then it goes to waste, and it's not like this item helps you find the spies to begin with.

[Digital-Maniac]

What as a counter-gadget some adrenaline function

No, hard-counter gadgets = bad.

What I'm thinking is the slowing gadget slows the spies to the merc's run speed, and removes the speed bonus from diving.

There are several ways this can be put into the game:

-A passive defense that could work either like a spy trap, proxy mine, or PD that shoots something that slows you to the merc's speed for a short period of time (figure like 10 seconds) when you trip it.
-A grenade that leaves a cloud
-A grenade that explodes on contact
-A direct shot device that you aim and shoot with your gun, maybe like a netting or some goo or something

When I was thinking of this, I was more thinking of a direct-shot device, since it would be most useful when you are actually chasing the spy. The passive trap would be my last choice because the utility of the gadget comes from when you have already spotted the spy. If he trips the defense when you're not around then it goes to waste, and it's not like this item helps you find the spies to begin with.

Oh you mean like an Intsa nade? I see

[Farley4Fan]

Lol that's what I said here:  "You basically get an insta nade everytime, which is bad."

Why?  Why try and prove insta nades to be bad and then promote a new type of nade which does that everytime?  An instant nade that slows spies down, which would usually mean an easy kill for mercs, is just as bad as an instant frag nade.  Well maybe it doesn't kill him instantly, but will get him killed.  The spy has no defense against an instantly slowing down nade and his chances of escaping at all are abysmal.  Aggro will basically be killed by this one suggestion.

[Westfall]

I said the net thing as a joke. The slowdown nade IS the phosphorous nade imo. Instead of hurting the spy, it can slow him down.

Still thinking about the tripwire. Don't really seea purpose when there would be no way for a merc to counter it. "Shoot it out." Even cams you can shoot out, but you also have a gasmask. Are we going to give the merc a pair of scissors? I don't think another KO is necessary for the merc when you can jump him of make him zzzzz.

[Westfall]

Oh you mean like an Intsa nade? I see

Double post: Cut it out with the "insta nade" nonsense. It was a nice observation, but it takes away from game play 100%. Metal wasn't supposed to have a weak point. Especially when it came to a grenade. I can understand the "chances" that something might instantly explode because it was defective, which was the mindset I established when getting pissed about getting screwed by CT when I got insta-ed. Get off of it already. Its an exposed LAME point. Think more game play and less bug.

[Gawain]

Gawain, why would you want to get away 3s earlier if you could hack 4s longer?

because the risk of getting killed isn't usually worth hacking some seconds longer? because even if you get away the merc sees which way you take?  once again, you obviously have no clue. ::)

What I'm thinking is the slowing gadget slows the spies to the merc's run speed, and removes the speed bonus from diving.

sounds like the perfect speed to me. i'll add this to the properties list and create a new topic for ph.nades so that this thread can focus on alternatives.

[Daybreak]

Wouldn't it be easier just to copy the slow affect for the smokenade for mercs, then apply it to the phospho nade? Personally, i'd use the slownade as described. Then if the spy is smart, he could roll through, be slowed slightly, but then has the inability to hide well due to the emf.

slownade:
-slows down spies while in phosphorous cloud ie:phosphorous gas
-spy is now visible on emf
-spy glows slightly and leaves foot prints

smokenade
-slows down Mercs while in phosphors.
-Merc can't see
-smoke nade knocks out mercs.

Mercs have the gas mask rendering all most all but the vision.

perhaps spies could have a anti phosphorus suit that pervents them from being picked up on emf. Like the camo, it'd have to be activated and could give off a loud noise when used so the merc knows he removed the phospho glow. The spy would still be slowed.

[Spekkio]

Wouldn't it be easier just to copy the slow affect for the smokenade for mercs, then apply it to the phospho nade?

Too extreme.

Lol that's what I said here:  "You basically get an insta nade everytime, which is bad."

I phrased it wrong. I meant that basically it would work like a frag grenade -- similar timer and all.

[Farley4Fan]

Gawain, why would you want to get away 3s earlier if you could hack 4s longer?

because the risk of getting killed isn't usually worth hacking some seconds longer? because even if you get away the merc sees which way you take?  once again, you obviously have no clue. ::)

No no no, you got it all wrong Gawain.  I mean with the trip wire you could still have that possible 4s to hack w/o being at risk.  I'd risk just 1 life to get 1/3 objectives finished anyways.  ESPECIALLY on aqua.  Obviously I was giving my example without having a teammate around because well, I didn't mention a teammate at all.  Comprehension problems maybe?