disk type objective

[Farley4Fan]

The question is, would the disc appear on the merc's radar when dropped?  If so, dropping it wouldn't be the smartest thing to do, unless you dropped it somewhere mercs could not reach.

[Xris]

Ahh late again!
FYI i've stealth the museum disk b4 by cooping back up to spawn, and dropping in the outside case.
He was crouched about to place a proxy beside the case, i jumped on him from spawn and put the disk in the case ... gg

[Farley4Fan]

That's not stealthing it.  It's a mix of stealth and aggro.

[Gawain]

papa, how about reading my suggestion before asking dumb questions?

[Farley4Fan]

I didn't see anything about that in your suggestions...  I'll look again...

Nope, nothing there about it appearing on the merc's radar.  Nada.  Zip.

That would be incredibly stupid if it did appear, but it could be nice for escaping situations.  For instance, you could drop a disc somewhere if a merc is right on your tail and he'll think that the stationary disc is you just standing still.  But I don't know, just wondering what it would be like.

[Gawain]

just for you:

i discussed this with kubanator and we agreed that this could work:
-battery get acticated once the disk is dropped somewhere (manually by spy or when the spy gets killed)
-battery loaded <50%: disk shows up on merc radar
-battery at 0%: data gone

[Farley4Fan]

 :D  Right, I was looking at the lower suggestions where it was talking about dropping discs...

Here's what I said about radar/dropping discs:

That would be incredibly stupid if it did appear, but it could be nice for escaping situations.  For instance, you could drop a disc somewhere if a merc is right on your tail and he'll think that the stationary disc is you just standing still.  But I don't know, just wondering what it would be like.

[Westfall]

:D  Right, I was looking at the lower suggestions where it was talking about dropping discs...

Here's what I said about radar/dropping discs:

That would be incredibly stupid if it did appear, but it could be nice for escaping situations.  For instance, you could drop a disc somewhere if a merc is right on your tail and he'll think that the stationary disc is you just standing still.  But I don't know, just wondering what it would be like.

With the battery idea, It would drain after a while and then light up on the screen. The spy would easily have been able to drop and move on before the disk lights up...merc then figures out whats going on, and tries to search for you again. Then again, you could stay near by and grab it again and continue towards the drop off ;)

[InvisibleMan999]

disk obj are just like every other objective, both 100% aggro and 100% stealth aren't as effective as a good mix of both.

Unfortunately, with disks it's not even close to a good mix. It's 99% aggro and 1% stealth. About the only stealth use of the disk is as a misdirection for your partner, but if you actually want to complete the disk objective, stealthing it is pretty much a non-option.

it's not that having the disk on you is nothing but a disadvantage, you can also make a lot of pressure on the mercs by simply having the disk:
if you stealth they don't know if they should guard the other objectives or the drop-off zone, or through which bottle-neck you intend to rush to which drop-off zone. if you play aggro, the mercs are pretty much occupied with spamming nades, mines etc, avoiding to leave the drop-off zones and bottlenecks or get tazed so that your mate has an easy time sneaking past them or getting a kill etc.

Honestly, I love it when stealth spies grab a disc. It means they're going to waste a ton of time even if they succeed. Seriously, I mean if I see the orange dot moving rapidly toward the drop off, I know they're going there, otherwise I assume it's a misidrection, so only one merc is patrolling the drop off. And it's seriously pretty easy to guard drop offs against a guy going slowest speed. And even if by some miracle, he sneaks by you... oh well, he just wasted a ton of time going on slowest speed across the entire level for one objective. 

So really if you don't see the orange dot, most of the time I'll give them the disc objective. 

implementing the disk drop-off zones better (= having at least 2/disk) and implementing slow-climbing is sufficient. not giving alert when removing the disk is a  very bad idea. being able to switch disks with your mate doesn't hurt/change gameplay, but gives the players a little more options.
being able to drop the disk could be easily balanced if it was running on a battery that lasts like 2min when not connected to the spy suit and once connected slowly recharges.

Having a silent pickup is pretty much the only way to get mercs to patrol pickup zones, otherwise they don't even bother. Not to mention it'd make stealthing the disk a lot more reliable and give stealth spies a boost. As a stealth spy, I can certainly say that disk objectives are among the worst things that I can see on a map. They are the complete bane of the stealth spy.

Slow climb would make things only slightly better. Honestly I'm not sure why we should even make slow climb and not just apply it to all climbing. It's not like the spy climbs all that fast anyway. It'd also be nice if you had some kind of grace period before going on radar, so you can do a few sudden fast moves like dropping from a vent or jumping without setting it off. On a side note, I'd like that feature for camo too. So you can drop out of a vent without losing your camo.

[Kurbutti]

The reason why people thinks disc just has to be exctacted every single time is beyond me. Map design is just bad in maps like orphanage where the only reasonable thing to do with the disc is to run like hell. There are some custom maps made for CT that have multiple objective typs within them, and in maps like that it's a sound tactic to get the disc and keep the mercs busy tracking you, while your mate sneaks into hacking position. It makes no difference whether if it's a "misdirection" or not. If you don't respond to the disc carrier you're certainly going to lose it. Actually, you're right; it's a decoy you just can't and don't want to miss. I've done that a lot of times and the merc near the target objective will never have the time to stop both of us from completing the objective.

[Westfall]

Disk objectives will be more worth it when the drop offs are placed further apart from each other. Disk was probably one of the best objectives to work on because it fucks up the mercenary. "They waste a ton of time"...not if you know what you're doing. Then it works out perfectly. 

[Kurbutti]

What matters the most is whether mercs can access the drop point themselves. Untouchable drop offs are usually mine free so that favors rapid extraction over anything else.

[Farley4Fan]

You guys both make good points, however, you're kind of beating a dead horse.  There isn't much to do to turn the disc into a "Stealth-able" objective.  It's like turning black into white.  There are a few things that can be done to help a bit of stealth be possible for disc, but in reality it will always be making a hightail for the dropoff and hoping the merc bites the bait so your partner can hack. :-\

I would like it though if you could stealth a bit easier to a certain point, then once you are in a good position to make a dash for the drop off you go for it.  Slow climb is one of those things, as is dropping the disc - dropping it to scout the area ahead then grabbing it and going would be a good thing imo.  But the main factor is map design and the ways that are possible to get to a dropoff.  2 dropoffs close to eachother (aqua) is bad map design.  Forcing mercs to leave their positions to guard them sounds like a good solution.

[Gawain]

it's not a bad thing that completing the disk objective forces you to use some aggro. yet with better map design and a slow-climb move i think the stealth aspect becomes way stronger. making the merc cover the disk spawn or drop off to see if the disk was removed is totally redundant (when the disk becomes actually a valid objective because the drop offs aren't that bad like in cafe) due to the fact that the merc is already punished when the spy takes the disk the stealth way: he isn't close enough to the spy to stop her from taking the disk and the spy can go unnoticed in any direction.

[BurningDeath]

he isn't close enough to the spy to stop her from taking the disk

wtf - female spies? :D