balancing of sticky cams

[frvge]

I advice to control+a and copy before submitting large posts.

[Farley4Fan]

Yeah I summarized it here.

When did uzi become such a problem anyways?  It has no long range capabilities.  If a merc has an uzi/shotty, don't get close to them.  Problem solved.  But I do agree tazer should be buffed, atleast with its range.  When I said situation I meant who you are playing against and what their playstyles are.  If they are an aggro bunch of spies, then you should bring uzi/shotty.  If they are a stealthy group of spies that stay away from mercs, bring a sniper. 

Think about that.

[Gawain]

uzi is too strong as it's effective 90% of the time the two sides get sight of another. the distances between merc and spy occuring on most maps (exceptions: vertigo, polar) are simply not that huge. with more scattering and less magazine capacity it may be balanced, but atm the only reason it's not used that much are the lagg issues.
there is really no need for more than one weapon as more mid range power would always be imbalanced and you can boost close combat power with tazer.

[Farley4Fan]

The reason that I don't use uzi that much IS NOT BECAUSE OF LAG!  It is because there are times where spies are very far from me and there is no chance that I would even lay one bullet on the spy, even with a lot of bullets and precise aim.  Ex:  Deftech outside.  You always will see a spy on the other side of the area, sub is totally useless here in this example.  A sniper however, you could take him out easily.

People would rather be safe away from spies and sniping them from afar, then if spies were right up in their grills with a possibility of them getting grabbed with a sub.  Yes, tazer needs a boost.  But, if you only have 4 fucking gadget slots because you have a forced gadget ( camnet ), then there wouldn't be any room for it anyways.  Why?  Because 99% of mercs take the same loadout - Frags, mines, backpack, gasmask.  No room for tazer, so, sub should be kept imo.  But, if you add 5 gadget slots ( with no gadget forcing bs ) then you would have a welcome spot for a tazer and a sniper combo.

See what I mean?

[Gawain]

deftech is a terrible example, the balance on this map is totally screwed.

[Spekkio]

Yea, the addition of mask made it beyond repair I think.

[Farley4Fan]

It wasn't the fact that it was balanced!  It was the fact that you couldn't do shit to someone from that range, totally missed the point. 

But yeah, I agree, it was totally messed up.

[InvisibleMan999]

Playstyle has nothing to do with it. Good players are going to discover this stuff and use it.

Yeah it does. It's like saying "Lets remove flashbangs, because I don't go aggro." For my playstyle, I wouldn't even care. For people like Mr.Mic who routinely triple nade as a loadout, that's going to hurt.

Similarly, not everyone runs a long distance sniping merc strategy. Some people prefer to be up in the spy's face, covering locations at short range.

Umm, how about you put it into PS virtually unchanged from PT? Seems pretty balanced then. Or did you not play PT?

I played PT. Thing is that sniping has evolved a lot since PT. Back in PT we were all learning the game, and really, you didn't see the kind of sniping uses that you see in CT now. While PT itself hasn't changed, the tactics have evolved to the point where sniping is a lot more powerful than originally intended.

Your entire argument boils down to this: "I'm a n00b who can't aim, so I want a gun that has a super high ROF so I can spray all over the place like an idiot.

I don't even care about RoF, they can make an uzi weapon that has the same ROF as a rifle, but just does more damage. Whatever. So long as it's more effective at medium range.

Not trying to turn this into a PC vs XBox war, but you really ought to get more PC playing experience with CT before forming an opinion on a topic like this. PS is going to be on the PC, not Xbox.

I've played CT on PC quite a bit. All my PT experience is on PC pretty much. Even on PC, I just was never much of a sniper. Aside from Vertigo, I don't really remember using the sniper much on PT against good spies. Granted I didn't go out of my way to find super effective spots, but then like I said, that's not really my playstyle.

the sniper rifle is quite balanced because the spies can prevent someone from using the scope by ss on the head or chaff; you can kick him out of scope with flash. a merc in sniper mode is also more vulnerable for grabs, cams etc and sneaking past him due to less mobility and smaller fov. the delay it takes to get into scope mode allows the spy enough time to ss you if you don't expect him.

Are you kidding? The delay is almost negligible to raise the rifle. In a somewhat laggy game, the host gets into sniper mode before you can even effectively hear the sniper "click" to respond to it.

Seriously, this is the PC version of the game we're talking about, not the xbox one... I know you've seen some uber snipers, probably better snipers than I have. It generally goes like sniper click, half second, dead. Sniping is crazy powerful. There's really no great counter. Taking out the SS generally just makes you more of a stationary target. I always found the best way to beat snipers is to run around and keep constantly rolling to reduce the chance of a head shot. Aside from that, generally if you ever stop moving to take a shot, they get your head first, unless you're very lucky.

And seriously, what's up with the uzi hatred anyway? So some people prefer to just have a gun that sprays bullets, who cares? That's their playstyle, let them. Apparently they're missing out on all the uber sniping opportunities anyway. In return they get to kill you better at medium range.

As far as the infamous lag issues... the uzi doesn't lag me much at all, both on PC and on xbox. Maybe your graphics settings are set too high and it overloads your card or your internet connection just needs an upgrade. I don't know, but I haven't experienced the uber lag effects that you guys are talking about and my graphics card is hardly uber (then I don't play with maxed settings either). Sure, host uzi is a bitch, but so is host rifle. Having a 0 ping is going to be a big advantage... with any weapon. The uzi doesn't gain any magical advantage the other weapons don't. On any side, the host is an advantage. Host grabs, host uzi, host rifle... yeah the host rocks... hopefully a good dedicated server program can fix that. The host uzi isn't even as bad as host rifle, because at least the uzi requires you to be at reasonably close range. So it's possible to hear the merc's footsteps or otherwise spot him with spybullets before he gets close enough for a host uzi kill. About your only argument against the uzi is that it's some no aim noob weapon and isn't elitist enough for you all.

I haven't seen the uber uzi problem you are all whining about. If a "noob" such as myself can routinely play against and beat people using the uzi, I think you guys can too. Or maybe you're just getting rid of the uzi because you have trouble beating it?

[Westfall]

I haven't seen the uber uzi problem you are all whining about. If a "noob" such as myself can routinely play against and beat people using the uzi, I think you guys can too. Or maybe you're just getting rid of the uzi because you have trouble beating it?

Nice attempt at a counter. I assume you play X-Box? Uzi is hard to counter because on PC, if a spy gets shot with the UBER LEET UZI, they are practically frozen and can't get out of the ridiculous ray of bullets. For instance: If I were to hack outside cafe on Museum and a merc came around the corner and sprayed me with uzi, every attempt I make to get the fuck out is completely worthless, because you really just freeze. The problem is with the hit animation. When you get shot with rifle your screen turns a little red. When you get sprayed with uzi, your screen turns red over and over at a rapid pace causing insta-pwn-death.

Again, my point is that uzi takes no skill. "Oh, theres a spy over there": SPRAY 360 bullets. Jesus...real talent there. You might as well be playing the game on "easy mode" A headshot is only so powerful if you can make it happen. If you miss, then it wasn't all that powerful now was it? AND, if you are a smart spy, you should be watching your back, your partner should be watching your back, or you should have spy bullets down AT ALL TIMES. 

I've beaten teams when they were using uzi too. As soon as that game was over, I ask them politely not to use it again because it lags too hard. And no, its not my hardware. My PC meets more than the requirements...easily.

I'm sorry, but uzi either needs to be cut down a lot, or just not even put in the game. In my eyes, people that use it are pretty much noobs because they can't handle the rifle (aka a real gun for this game).

[Farley4Fan]

Just because a spy's screen goes red doesn't mean there is OmG SUpEr UBEr LAGG BS!!11!1  It means that there is a problem that ubi overlooked, rapid fire.  Don't get rid of rapid fire, get rid of the red screen.  Then, you won't be frozen, you can see what is goin on, and you can escape.  Just fix the Uzi's "problems", don't remove it completely.  That is like removing the frag because sometimes it can be overpowered and have little glitches ( insta nade ).  Totally stupid logic.  Just fix it.

UZI DOES NOT EQUAL NOOB!  UZI EQUALS CLOSE RANGE COMBAT POWER THAT SNIPER CANNOT ACHIEVE!  GET THAT THROUGH YOUR HEADS!

At times, I will use the uzi.  NOT because I suck at sniping, but because certain maps/strategies/spy playing style require CLOSE RANGE COMBAT.  In that case, I would rather not have something that can kill from long range combat, but I would rather have something that can deal damage up close. 

[Westfall]

UZI DOES NOT EQUAL NOOB!  UZI EQUALS CLOSE RANGE COMBAT POWER THAT SNIPER CANNOT ACHIEVE!

You must be a big Deathmatch player.

At times, I will use the uzi.  NOT because I suck at sniping, but because certain maps/strategies/spy playing style require CLOSE RANGE COMBAT.  In that case, I would rather not have something that can kill from long range combat, but I would rather have something that can deal damage up close.

What is the bull-charge/berserk for? Granted you knock a spy down, his partners there, and you get grabbed because of the animation. This would happen regardless if you bullcharge with an uzi. Rifle actually fires pretty well if you have a good aim. Realize how big the spy really is.

Sniping feature is only really there to counter what the uzi can't do in terms of long range. Uzi is completely useless when it comes to this style game (As Spekkio has already stated). What the fuck do I know though.

[neth]

Nice attempt at a counter. I assume you play X-Box? Uzi is hard to counter because on PC, if a spy gets shot with the UBER LEET UZI, they are practically frozen and can't get out of the ridiculous ray of bullets. For instance: If I were to hack outside cafe on Museum and a merc came around the corner and sprayed me with uzi, every attempt I make to get the fuck out is completely worthless

Thats your problem, you dont want to change your playstyle, so you want to get rid of uzi. Lemme guess if the merc had rifle (like in situation above) you would wait hacking as long as you can, then freeze him and run away...I* guess that most ppl here flaming on uzi are just aggro players. OMG ppl if some dudes want to take this wpn why you want to forbid it. Best way to counter uzi is to avoid fighting merc. My advice - when you see uzi guy, just switch to stealth.

[Gawain]

just showes us again that the console players don't know shit about ct.
a good spy will taze you and get obstacles/walls or at least distance between him and you. simply try how far a spy can run/dive in the time the merc is shocked, and you'll see that you have no chance of killing him with uzi unless lagg or hit animation bs kicks in; the sniper rifle is your best chance to kill a fleeing spy. good spies won't allow you to shoot at them at medium range without obstacles or smoke/flash/chaff. uzi is stronger when you surprise the spy in medium/close range, but this is almost impossible against good spies since they use hbs/bullets and have a general idea where the mercs might be. with the limited range of hbs, you have a better chance of unexpectedly killing a spy with longs range shots.
it's also not too weak in medium or close range without laggs as you may have noticed playing as host. if you need scattering and some form of lock-on against aggro, you should try using the laser.

[a3c0i3d]

I'm sorry, but uzi either needs to be cut down a lot, or just not even put in the game. In my eyes, people that use it are pretty much noobs because they can't handle the rifle (aka a real gun for this game).

Jeez man, we get the point, all uzi players are skilles noobs. So the reason you dont take it is because you can use the challenge and take the more PRO rifle? Bullshit, you take it because it suits your playstyle better, and because you think its the better weapon. Why do all the top teams use the sniper? Because they need the challenge? NO, because they think its the better weapon! I take the uzi because it suits my playstyle better, and i hate agro spies.
So you should praise the uzi players for playing with an inferior weapon instead of flaming them.

You hate uzi lag, i hate headshots.

If PS strives to be a clone, they should be including the shotty and uzi. Players are just gonna pick the weapon that suits them the best. Or depending on what their mate carries, or what favours the map, or what kinda team they are up against. Lets give the players the option to choose that. Uzi and shotty lack the distance, so they make that up with close range power. I always had to run alot more through the maps, because my uzi didnt have the range, thus leaving me exposed to grabs and cams more often. I had the advantage on close range. So good spies would see that, and keep their distance.

And again, yes we know it by now, all uzi players are noobs.

[Gawain]

if you want advantage in close range, use tazer.
and no, it's not a clone of ct, it's rather taking the best of pt and ct.