Instead of berserk

[neth]

Perhaps yours would look better but mine is also cool, its easier to add and has a reasonable explanation. Thats why i think mine is slightly better than yours.

[Farley4Fan]

How is someone electrifying themselves more reasonable than someone doing my move?  Either way, a new animation would have to be made anyways so it's not easier to add really.  How is mine not reasonable exactly? ???

[neth]

Work on your animation > work on mine

Shocky effect will be in game anyway so theres not much to do.

I didnt say your concept is not reasonable.

[B1nArY_001]

My suggestion would be re-examine the affect of the attack on a jumping spy. It works fine and makes perfect sense, if you tried to jump on someone performing that move your legs would likely slide of the head and get fouled on the spinning shoulders sending you tumbling to the ground probably right on your head. We just need to make the spy's animation when hit by the berserk a little more realistic. With physics and rag-doll effects this should be quite possible. Just my 2 cents.

yeah, but berserk animation is silly. You try to jump on merc's head and you do so and then you get smashed by hand that doesnt even touch you, wtf ?

Read my post a little more carefully,

"My suggestion would be re-examine the affect of the attack on a jumping spy. It works fine and makes perfect sense, if you tried to jump on someone performing that move your legs would likely slide of the head and get fouled on the spinning shoulders sending you tumbling to the ground probably right on your head."

You don't get hit by a hand period, the merc swings his gun in a 360 degree arc bashing anything around him. No different than a move a sword fighter would use to force multiple attackers back or to even strike multiple attackers. Just because it's simplistic doesn't mean unrealistic. Now, what IS unreallistic is the way a spy collapses after jumping a berserking merc. All that needs to happen is the spy needs a preset animation where he lands on his head/falls to the ground or whatever and blend that with some physics so that the spy's legs get caught up in the spinning shoulders flinging him to the ground. I'm sure physics could even be used to make the spy's fall somewhat affected by the inertia from the spinning merc increasing the realism of the move/failed jump.

Edit: If you don't think spinning prevents being jumped on, go get one of your friends give him a helmet and jump on him while he spins 360 degrees in .75-1.00 seconds. Then send me a picture of your friend laughing at you as you crack your skull or sprain a wrist trying to catch yourself. it works because the jumper's motion/kinetic energy is transfered in the direction of the spin as he lands on the spinning person/object dispersing the impact forces.

Another thing to note is that the animations in CT don't match with the way a jump occurs, the feet land about shoulder width apart and the hands come down in a double-fisted hammer blow stopping 6-8 inches up from the feet. This suggests that the intention was the feet land planted on the shoulders driving the merc towards the ground while the hands drop down bashing the merc on the top of the head. If this is what they intended then the berserk would make perfect sense, you can't plant your feet on spinning shoulders.

[neth]

if you tried to jump on someone performing that move your legs would likely slide of the head and get fouled on the spinning shoulders sending you tumbling to the ground probably right on your head.

I read it before.
No mate, im not gonna slide off and this dude is gonna die with cracked head no matter if he spins or dances.
Im not gonna do it with friend but imagine what would happen if I threw a big damn stone from 1st floor exactly on your head and you would spin at that time.

[Farley4Fan]

He hits everything around him with his arms, I can see that yes, but it does not hit anything above him WHATSOEVER.

And neth by saying that yours was reasonable I thought you were saying that mine wasn't.  I still don't see why a merc what shock himself with electricity.

[Gawain]

berserk is unrealistic but fits into the gameplay, so what is all the fuss about?

[B1nArY_001]

if you tried to jump on someone performing that move your legs would likely slide of the head and get fouled on the spinning shoulders sending you tumbling to the ground probably right on your head.

I read it before.
No mate, im not gonna slide off and this dude is gonna die with cracked head no matter if he spins or dances.
Im not gonna do it with friend but imagine what would happen if I threw a big damn stone from 1st floor exactly on your head and you would spin at that time.

There's a big difference between a stone and a human. Humans have 2 legs that the balance has to be distributed across and the stone does not have to consider how it lands. If you jump from 10 feet onto someone's head you are going wind up with your feet sliding off the head, the head is domed and the feet will slide off opposite sides.This is not even considering if that person was spinning which makes the head a moving target that because of the spinning motion and domed shape will cause most blows to glance off You would likely break or sprain an ankle. It's simple physics.

If you think you can perform that jump with no ill affects then good for you. I'm a pretty physical person having studied several combat systems and being a former gymnast, fencer and water polo player but I sure as hell wouldn't try to land on a spinning person from even 4 feet above them. I would get hurt. So would they but I imagine if they had the merc's helmet and armor it would just be me getting hurt. Now if they were not spinning I imagine it would be pretty simple to land with my feet firmly planted on their shoulders driving them to the ground. Anyhow, I'm not trying to get into a debate over it. This is just my opinion take it or leave it.  ;)

[theyearis1945]

this may sound retarded but... maybe equip the merc with some type of spiked armguard? so instead of berserk you just kind of hold your arm up to protect yourself? the spike would kill the spy and there could be an animation of the merc kind of catching the spy with the armguard and then kind of throwing him to the side?

this armguard would also be an interesting idea for charging... arm guard out in front of the merc as he charges?

i dont know if it sounds over powered to you but im just trying to throw around an idea i thought was cool

if you dont like the idea of spikes.. (not high tech enough)  it could be an electricly charged arm guard or whatever.

[Digital-Maniac]

I don't know if we want the spy to die as Spies don't die when you smack them anyway.  Remember sometimes a Merc hits a spy and can't find him amidst smoke, flash bangs, and a team mate trying to protect the knocked out mate.  So a merc killing a spy instantly wouldn't be feasible.

[Cyntrox]

I agree that the effect shouldn't be any more powerful, but an arm guard could work... I can see spikes shooting out from their hidden spots in his suit as he charges, that would be awesome ;D

[theyearis1945]

remove the spikes and just have him 'catch the spy' and kind of repel him off

[seefoo.]

merc side step.  seee the spai coming from top.   press button, take a step to the side and commence gun butt bashing to the spai face.

[frvge]

Either a quick sidestep+swing gun to the direction he came from (works ok for jumping spy, dunno about grabbing spy) or the arm guard: 1 arm aimed up to hurt the jumping spy and 1 arm used to swing around like the current berserk.

[Cyntrox]

The move from CT coop could work? When one of the players tried to jump on another, the spy at the bottom would raise his hand and kind of push the other spy away. Add spikes, boil in twenty minutes and you've got a knocked out spy :P