Spy Stealth Weapon

[Westfall]

And I don't think the maneuver is remotely imbalanced. The only people complaining about it are Xbox players, who don't even have it available.

+1

[Farley4Fan]

I am only going off of what I hear.  And by what I've heard, it's basically a move that can get you through lasers with no sound/alerting mercs whatsoever.  But, now that I know that it is hard to master I'm not so against it.  Even if it is balanced, map makers will have to raise the heights of lasers that they don't want them to get through so quietly.

[Spekkio]

I am only going off of what I hear.  And by what I've heard, it's basically a move that can get you through lasers with no sound/alerting mercs whatsoever.  But, now that I know that it is hard to master I'm not so against it.  Even if it is balanced, map makers will have to raise the heights of lasers that they don't want them to get through so quietly.

Why don't you play the game first instead of opening your mouth about shit when you have no clue about it.

[frvge]

Don't pull a "Fox vs Mass Effect" here :p lolz.

[Ion.67]

60-80% of the time it takes in ct to recover from a high fall should be enough. maybe no delay at all if you press/do a roll at just the right moment (hopefully there will be no auto-roll in ps).

EVERYONE STOP COMPARING TO SCCT ITS A NEW ENGINE MEANS THIS SHIT WONT HAPPEN

I assume you are talking about the 60-80%? That is not a bug, it is a feature. We were discussing how long the down time should be after a fall.

If you are talking about auto-roll, that is also a feature. It is a feature that is not well liked anyway.

[InvisibleMan999]

It's entirely different from the vision glitch.  Changing visions has absolutely nothing to do with falling.  Period.  The Crouch-roll-crouch is a skillful approach to the game, regardless if it was intended to be in the game or not.  I think it makes the game more interesting and it requires skill to use, which makes the game more complex but in a desired way.  If anything, the Crouch-roll-crouch is far from a "glitch." 

Requiring skill or timing doesn't make something less of a glitch. The tech jump is still a glitch, even if it's somewhat tough to do. It's still not what was intended and lets you do something you're not supposed to be able to do.

Similarly being able to dive through lasers without making sound is probably not something we should allow in the game, regardless of how much perceived skill it might take. I've never really considered skill to be that sort of random timing anyway. That has nothing to do wtih what the merc does, it's just a pointless extra learning curve you're adding to the game to make it harder to pick up. The skill should be in beating the merc, not fighting difficult controls that make it hard to do stuff you want to do.

If we want people to be able to move faster while being silent, then simply make fast crouching faster. Pointlessly difficult controls doesn't make the game any better and most people don't want to waste an hour of their time just trying to master the timing of some crazy move that lets them move faster while being stealthy. Either let them do it or don't let them do it, but don't make it some crazy ordeal. I'm not a better person because I spent an hour perfecting the tech jump. It's an hour of my life that was spent doing something that isn't fun.

[Gawain]

you can't compare the crouch-dive-crouch move with a glitch into tech room on a single bad map.

[Gui Brazil]

I say keep the crouch-dive-crouch.

[Spekkio]

Requiring skill or timing doesn't make something less of a glitch. The tech jump is still a glitch, even if it's somewhat tough to do. It's still not what was intended and lets you do something you're not supposed to be able to do.

Using shitty map geometry to access an area that you shouldn't be able to access does not equate to performing a move that is afforded directly by the controls.

The crouch-dive-crouch move doesn't involve any extraneous factors like changing visions to break a landing or using invisible geometry to reach a new area. It is the normal progression of controls, and it's doable because crouch and roll aren't the same button. Even thinking about it realistically, an athletic person can dive from that kind of a position.

Still, as has been noted, whether or not it's a glitch is largely irrelevent. You think it's a glitch, and I don't. Okay. However, even if it is a glitch, sometimes "glitches" end up being good for gameplay. For example, in Counter-Strike, one of the most popular competitive online game in the world, you can glitch out of the AWM and Scout sniper rifle reload by pressing Q for "last weapon." Doing so allows you to shoot your pistol almost immediately instead of waiting for the animation. You can then go right back to the rifle and shoot without having to wait for the reload animation to complete. Furthermore, when you press "last weapon" while moving, your accuracy resets as if you were stationary, so your first shot will always be on target. Therefore, your reward for the extra finger work is that you have better accuracy and quicker shots. Valve patches CS quite frequently, and this is still part of the game years after its release because this "glitch" turned out to be a good feature of CS gameplay.

Moving to CT, your reward for good timing and extra finger work is being able to move more quickly without pinging the reticle. I don't see anything wrong with that. Moreover, it doesn't take an hour to learn how to do this move unless you have Parkinson's or something. Back up lasers with mines and spy traps, or use camnet, and you won't have a problem.

[Westfall]

I do have Parkinson's, so its quite ridiculous how loud my spy is and how many lasers I trip. Oh wait....that's the server.

[Farley4Fan]

I am only going off of what I hear.  And by what I've heard, it's basically a move that can get you through lasers with no sound/alerting mercs whatsoever.  But, now that I know that it is hard to master I'm not so against it.  Even if it is balanced, map makers will have to raise the heights of lasers that they don't want them to get through so quietly.

Why don't you play the game first instead of opening your mouth about shit when you have no clue about it.

I shouldn't have to.  All I've heard about it from YOU guys is that it is basically a move that can get you through any set of lasers silently.  That sounds ridiculously stupid to me.   NOW that I know that it is harder to master, then it's okay I guess.  But if it is in PS, it shouldn't be easy to pull off.  If it is, then why even have laser grids?

[Spekkio]

I shouldn't have to.  All I've heard about it from YOU guys is that it is basically a move that can get you through any set of lasers silently.  That sounds ridiculously stupid to me.   NOW that I know that it is harder to master, then it's okay I guess.  But if it is in PS, it shouldn't be easy to pull off.  If it is, then why even have laser grids?

It doesn't matter how much or little you've heard from people who have played the game; you have no clue what you're talking about regarding the balance of this move until you actually play the game for a while. If you log a decent amount of time playing CT on the PC and still think this maneuver is so omfg imba, then ok. Until then, you have no business saying anything about it.

[Farley4Fan]

K, think about it spekkio.  You have an opinon on the Iraq war right?  Well, have you ever experienced it or seen it up close and personal?  Probably not.   But by going off of what you hear, you have an opinion on it.  Just like I have an opinion on something that I've only heard about.

[Ion.67]

Spekkio is going into the military as far as I know.

You don't know how it works. But, even then, you need to master it, which makes it a viable move.

[Farley4Fan]

I respect him going into the military but most people only have opinions of things based off of what they hear about the Iraq war.  Based on what I've heard, up until this point, what I heard was that it was an move that could get you through any set of lasers silently with no drawback.  Doesn't that sound overpowered to you?  And now I know that it is hard to completely master it I'm not so against it.