How do you think PS would play if the spy had a pistol?

[DreadStunLock]

Yeah, but this all comes down to this:


Frvge says: We have to first release Project Stealth 1.0 and after that is done fully, we will consider doing something different, bladdy bla :))

[Farley4Fan]

Unless you have a flashlight pointing everywhere including out of your ass, this won't work, as well as the spy needs to get close to a mercenary to gut him, and even now in DM, a spy can easily bash a mercenary.

I don't really follow what you're saying here.

I'm saying a knife gadget, for DM, would make your standard elbow attack do damage to a merc.  This is just brainstorming for ideas to balance DM, which is already completely in merc favor.  I'm not looking out for the merc.

[Cronky]

Unless you have a flashlight pointing everywhere including out of your ass, this won't work, as well as the spy needs to get close to a mercenary to gut him, and even now in DM, a spy can easily bash a mercenary.

I don't really follow what you're saying here.

I'm saying a knife gadget, for DM, would make your standard elbow attack do damage to a merc.  This is just brainstorming for ideas to balance DM, which is already completely in merc favor.  I'm not looking out for the merc.

The only problem I have with the elbow attack doing damage is (at least in my head) that it's not actually too hard to simply elbow a Merc.

If it kills in 2 or 3 hits like you mentioned before, then it might be easier to just elbow than to go break their neck or jump on them. Unless the knife (when equipped) and the elbow attack is used, it doesn't knock the Merc back. If it still does the knock back, then it seems like even 1 spy could stun lock a Merc. 2 spies would just be overkill.

I think regardless of DM or Story mode, the neck break (I count ledge grab as this too) and jumping should still prevail as the MAIN way to kill people. Gadgets, both lethal and supportive, should simply help.

[Farley4Fan]

Well I said 3 or 4 hits because I imagine that 2 spies doing this could be op.  But when you think about an average battle how many times do you think a merc gets elbowed?  As long as spies can't do the tennis hit thing back and forth I think 4,5 hits would be okay.  I don't know though.  The thing I'm wondering is if the concept sounds interesting, because it's difficult to say how much damage would be balanced.  Maybe the knife slice wouldn't knock back the merc as much as the elbow would making it harder for the spy to get away after slicing the merc.

Something that might be annoying is people bitching that it isn't an option in story mode.  Might filter all the whiny, stabby, action people to deathmatch which I see as a good thing.

But I agree with your grabbing point.  If the netcode is better, less lag, no more elbowing someone in the back, then grabbing should be easier anyway.  The knife would be a useless addition.  

[Cronky]

I think the knife is still a really good idea, especially for DM. Much like the pistol, even though the Pistol is effectively not happening anymore (at least in chat).

I just think that if the Elbow attack and Knife were combined then the knock back should be taken away. That way the Mercs can still retaliate even if both spies are rushing him.

Or having the Knife be passive like Dwarf mentioned before. Instead of using it to hurt Mercs, it's used to give another option in the way of hacking that you otherwise wouldn't have. If it altered other things, such as stabbing instead of neck breaks (again, if equipped), then that'd just be icing on the cake. Or if mappers are able to make environmental things that are effected by certain gadgets, and by that I don't mean just the knife. (Giving reasons to bring some of the less popular gadgets).

[DreadStunLock]

This is what I meant by a prop, it doesn't do anything, it's there for a nice look, same can be done with a knife or a pistol, or whatever you like.

By the way, there should be a more hardcore voice in-game, when you speak it should make noise if close enough to the mercenary, as well as the noise should be transmitted from the receiver too.

So if I speak it should make noise from me, and from my teammate.

[Cronky]

@Dread

The knife that's being talked about isn't the same as the Katana prop you proposed earlier.

Adding props to the characters would most likely be a bad idea (in PS). While doing equipment specific changes to the character models (take gasmask, have gasmask on. Take backpack, have backpack on) would be fine and unique.

Props only serve to take away from the experience in this case. You'll also potentially ruin the gameplay on a case to case basis. From small things like... making sure the cloak for the spy makes props disappear also (I'm thinking the cheaters lament on TF2 for the spy class, before it got patches). To bigger things like just being easier to see in general.

It works in games like Halo because the characters in the game have little effect on how the game is played. They're soldiers. They're all the same. Regardless of whether you play as a spartan or a elite. Whether you use one helmet or another doesn't matter. Differentiating between the look of each player holds no significance to the game.

Closest thing you can look to is again TF2. Notice they only really have hats. While they have a variety of different weapons, the visuals of each different weapon explain to you how the player is going to play.

At least that's how I see it.

[DreadStunLock]

Yeah but B1nary once stated ages ago, since they are taking so much time in making this game, and they actually stare at the models and the programming for very long hours, I doubt that will slip their mind, and yes I do understand that the knife is being discussed as a gadget and not as a prop. But still, I doubt props will make a drastic gameplay change.

[Cronky]

The effect may not be drastic, but if it affects gameplay at all then the Prop isn't acting like a prop.

Who would wear a sword on their back if they, in similar cases as a prop-less spy, get caught more often? Props like Halo again only work because no part of the gameplay relies on knowing what the other character looks like, only what they are wielding (Which can be constantly changing).

PS will rely on looks if they are actually implement stuff like having the backpack and gasmask. Some things could change, such as using a different skin (think Counter Strike). Which would be cool if they had climate specific skins. Props would just complicate the whole formula!



Just sayin. :)

[DreadStunLock]

The effect may not be drastic, but if it affects gameplay at all then the Prop isn't acting like a prop.

Who would wear a sword on their back if they, in similar cases as a prop-less spy, get caught more often? Props like Halo again only work because no part of the gameplay relies on knowing what the other character looks like, only what they are wielding (Which can be constantly changing).

PS will rely on looks if they are actually implement stuff like having the backpack and gasmask. Some things could change, such as using a different skin (think Counter Strike). Which would be cool if they had climate specific skins. Props would just complicate the whole formula!



Just sayin. :)

I seriously doubt the katan will be really standing out that heavily.

[Cronky]

You don't know though ;)

Unlike me, they should keep their characters and add-ons concise. Only adding extra things that make a benefit to the game. Not adding things that sound cool just for the sake of sounding cool.

If a Spy has flash grenades, they could have flash grenades somewhere on them. If the OCP thing got added, then the SS could have an added attachment on it. Katana on the back though? Meh. Halo did it.

[tigaer]

This is what I meant by a prop, it doesn't do anything, it's there for a nice look, same can be done with a knife or a pistol, or whatever you like.

By the way, there should be a more hardcore voice in-game, when you speak it should make noise if close enough to the mercenary, as well as the noise should be transmitted from the receiver too.

So if I speak it should make noise from me, and from my teammate.

Did you even play CT competitvely? These requests are something a ubi-casual gamer would ask for.

[AgentX_003]

lol no obviously not, he just started playing this year  LOL.

[DreadStunLock]

If I started this year agent-shaggy-doo, then you just plain suck, everytime you come on my server you rage quit so badly, and yet you don't even know it's me cause I smurf your sorry ass.

[AgentX_003]

If I started this year agent-shaggy-doo, then you just plain suck, everytime you come on my server you rage quit so badly, and yet you don't even know it's me cause I smurf your sorry ass.

[frvge edit: ok, we know you two don't really like eachother. Take it to a PM]