back to wall and rail camping -and other moves

[Farley4Fan]

Really it depends how far the sticky shocker knocks him back.  Like if it only knocked the merc back a few inches then it would be good.  But if it knocked him back like say as much as an elbow than that might be the wrong answer.

I am really starting to like this idea actually.  Imagine shooting a merc and he falls off the ledge, dies because of low health, and neutralizes a merc below him that he fell on  :D  That would be so cool  ;D

[goodkebab]

I think it will be only 1 step which is enough to get him off the Rail if you shoot from the right angle.

Getting tazed normally paralyzes your entire body and you collapse....so 1 step should be fine.

[Spekkio]

Here's the question:

How does the shocker discriminate between a merc perched on a rail and a merc on any other surface?

[Wanted_David]

The same way a spy is discriminated between any regular area and a coop move area.
OR make the merc move on step back when shocked, regardless the area he's on.

[frvge]

I am for knocking the merc 1 step back all the time. Only when he's not hit before. (so if you shock 3 times in fast in a row, only the 1st would make the merc step back).

[Spekkio]

I'm definitely not for that. It will change gameplay drastically in a lot of areas.

[InvisibleMan999]

I am for knocking the merc 1 step back all the time. Only when he's not hit before. (so if you shock 3 times in fast in a row, only the 1st would make the merc step back).

Yeah, I don't really think that will have too profound an effect on gameplay.

[Spekkio]

Sure it does. A merc can then be knocked off ANY platform he'd be standing on just by being shocked, whether or not it's a rail. For example, let's say a merc is sniping you in the theater room on Cinema. There is no railing on a part of that ledge. Now you just shock him and run in. I don't think that's very good for gameplay. The merc either has to stand at the edge and risk getting knocked off by nothing more than a shock, or he has to risk getting rail grabbed.

Not only that, SS+cam would become much easier because you're knocking a merc in a specific direction.

[Gawain]

the don't stop or change direction fix is clearly superior.

[B1nArY_001]

I'm definitely not for that. It will change gameplay drastically in a lot of areas.

About the only thing I can think if that would affect game play is knocking him back a step through a door and it closes making him wait for it to open again. and that could be very easily fixed by making the door stay open an extra few seconds. If the merc stands in the doorway he's asking to get trapped on the wrong side for an extra 4 or 5 serconds, he deserves the delay.  You would also avoid putting your back to an open edge, not a bad thing. But I see absolutely nothing about it that I feel I could not adapt to very easily as a merc.

[Spekkio]

There are many places a merc might stand where he has just enough LOS to shoot the spy. By shocking and knocking him back, he has to take a step forward and re-aim where he was because his view will be blocked.

For example, let's say a merc is on the boardwalk between Pirate and Greek. He is shooting at you neutralizing pirate. Now, this merc is already susceptible to cams because he's next to a wall, but under this new system you don't even have to do that: just shock him and he backs up enough where he can't see you. This gets you another 1-2 seconds off the objective than you'd ordinarilly have.

Honestly, rail camping, while gay, isn't that big of an issue as long as the map is made properly. The current maps where railcamping exists aren't imbalanced just because of rail camping, but because of poor design in general. The PS team can easily circumvent this by making sure that there is enough cover for spies and that rails have area above them or behind them so the merc is vulnerable. Plus, the old SS--->smoke ---> chaff usually gets a merc to move off his perch. Therefore, I don't think it's necessary to make a change that would have a universal effect on gameplay to fix a small problem. If they can make the SS "smart" and recognize whether or not the merc is on a rail, great. If not, then they should find another solution such as making a merc grabbable on a rail or having him fall off at a particular time. However, even with the latter you have to find a way to make it "smart," so if you can't do the SS idea you probably can't do the stop moving idea, either.

[InvisibleMan999]

For example, let's say a merc is on the boardwalk between Pirate and Greek. He is shooting at you neutralizing pirate. Now, this merc is already susceptible to cams because he's next to a wall, but under this new system you don't even have to do that: just shock him and he backs up enough where he can't see you. This gets you another 1-2 seconds off the objective than you'd ordinarilly have.

The SS is still going to stun you anyway, so it's not as though anything new is happening. Plus, like the SS works normally you'll only have one shot before the merc becomes immune for a while.

The distance to knock someone off a rail really isn't much. It takes what, maybe 2/10 of a second to traverse? I hardly see how it's going to give him 1-2 seconds off the objective. It'll buy him a marginal fraction of a second, but I don't feel like that will impact gameplay much.

As far as knocking people off other ledges, that could be a valid concern, but I'm thinking that mercs might just adapt and stand closer to the  middle of the ledge. The nudge should be very negligible, just small enough to knock a merc off a rail, so if you've got a whole ledge to play with, you should be fine.

[Cyntrox]

How about, instead of rail camping the merc just leans over the fence? Making him immobile and unable to shoot, but still giving him the better viewpoint.

If you do implent rail camping though, you should make it so that not only can the spy pull down the merc, but push him too if coming from the other side.

[Overstatement]

How about, instead of rail camping the merc just leans over the fence? Making him immobile and unable to shoot, but still giving him the better viewpoint.

I like this leaning over the rail thing but he should be able to shoot or there is no point in doing it. Any way to get the merc closer to the rails because I want more rail grabs but the mercs are too paranoid to go near any rail.

[goodkebab]

We are really talking about only 1/2 a footstep, if at all that.  It cannot be spammed cuz mercs are invulnerable for a few seconds. 

Also, in the example of pirates posted by Spekkio, the Merc would be pushed back along the angle of fire.  Not actually forcing him to be pushed around the corner.  So there would be no loss of time to recover position.  There would have to be a second spy to taze him from a different direction to push him back that 1/2 a foot

And finally,  this introduces new stategies to the game, which will force you guys to adapt.