New Coop Moves

[Farley4Fan]

Well if we did that then we would either have to make destructible lighting not in the game, or make the maps as lit up as CT.  Either that or make the crawl movement really slow.  How about a move that makes the spy roll sideways?  Like he gets on his side and rolls.  Ghost recon anyone?  You roll sideways while you are prone, know what I mean?  You can only do one roll then you are back in a crouched position.  This could be more balanced than a crawling movement or prone.

[greenday5494]

true, good ideas. but guys, good freakin luck coding all this!

They are good ideas. All of them. What we don't need is the attitude of "good luck fuckers." Maybe help out? Throw out some ideas how it would be easy to code this or offer assistance. Wouldn't you like to be part of something that could potentially could be fuckin sweet? Come on man....add good input or bad opinionation, but don't act snotty like that. You obviously knowa thing or 2, so help out.

no, i have no fucking idea how to code. hell, i barely know how to map in Hammer, let alone coding! stop being hostile, im just trying to be realistic, as in how the fuck are you going to implant this. jesus, calm the fuck down.

[Farley4Fan]

dude he was just sayin it would be a lot of work.  And it would be a lot of work/coding/animating to do.  But if it is possible then I am all for it.

[Vega]

no, i have no fucking idea how to code. hell, i barely know how to map in Hammer, let alone coding! stop being hostile, im just trying to be realistic, as in how the fuck are you going to implant this. jesus, calm the fuck down.

If you have no idea how to code, then how the hell do you know it would be hard?  You completely contradicted yourself and told someone who was calm to "jesus, calm the fuck down." 

Papa, don't quote a response such as greenday's (who was quoting Westfall's) when you were clearly going against Westfall's comment.  It makes no sense, it's as if arriving to a late party and saying "GREAT THE KEG IS KICKED."

[Farley4Fan]

Ummm, no.  I would want it in the game if it is even possible.  And I have heard from many people such as Goodkebab and more say animations like this would be hard to code, animate, etc.  If it is possible, then yes, it would be nice.  wtf are you talking about? 

[Vega]

Ummm, no.  I would want it in the game if it is even possible.  And I have heard from many people such as Goodkebab and more say animations like this would be hard to code, animate, etc.  If it is possible, then yes, it would be nice.  wtf are you talking about? 

I'm not talking about whether you want the animations in or not, I'm referring to the fact that you quoted (which I guess you edited beforehand) greenday's response but were in defense of him - hence the "dude he(meaning greenday) was just saying it's hard to code."  It's as if you were referring to Westfall but quoted greenday....which is what makes it confusing.

[Farley4Fan]

well obviously by what I said I wasn't talking to greenday.  And no, I never edited it.

[Westfall]

Like Vega said, I'm calm. I've been calm. Flaming is only happening now. I'm saying greenday's support of "good fuckin luck" isn't the most helpful thing yea?

I'm sure the coding is a bitch. I know nothing about it. The thread was made to get some new ideas in terms of coop, and we have a few good ideas that could be pretty sick in game if the programmers are willing to go for it when the time comes. Saying "good luck with that" isn't necessary. Instead, why not post more why you think it is messed up with the coding. BTW you're the last person in the world who would make me lose my cool.

This game, though a mod, is supposed to be BETTER. So why not try and make it just that, better. These coops mentioned are good and could be sick maybe with a few input refinements.

Lets get back on topic though and think of some more coop moves to possibly add. Can we get some mods in here or programmers to offer input on what would be smoothest for them? Would you like us to just give a set list of ideas on coops (with descriptions)?

Coop moves that I've read thus far:
   -laser beam mirrors
   -coop to disable cameras
   -Jump off of spy partner's back to grab ledge/knock out merc
   -grapple spy down to objective or grapple from ceiling to snap merc's neck.

Any more ideas/input?

[Farley4Fan]

I think that if we are going to add a lot of new things and make big changes we will need beta testing.   Which I think we are already having right?  Anyways, new coop moves would need testing as well as things like new visions or changed visions.

New Coop Moves I would Want:

Team rappelling - Faster than self rappelling, a teammate can lower you down a long vent shaft to a terminal or a place that is unaccessible w/o rappelling.

Self Rappelling - Slower than team rappelling but it doesn't occupy both spies at the same time.

Standing On Shoulders - This will need a few tweaks.  Disabling a camera for good by using this would be nice.

Laser Reflecting Move - One player reflects laser beams with his mirrors while the other player goes ahead.  For the sake of balance make sure only the reflector's teammate can go through.  This move would need a lot of redoing or changing.  I am not even sure that this would be a good idea.

Jumping off Back - Westfall already said this.


I don't know if I missed any but another move I would like is sideways rolling.  You go prone, roll sideways, roll under lasers/poison/laser mines.  This is not a crawl move.  You crouch, roll sideways, and at the end of your roll you are back in a crouched position.

[Overstatement]

Can we get some mods in here or programmers to offer input on what would be smoothest for them?

Programmers themselves are pretty notorious for underestimating every task. But the important thing is to keep your imaginations opened. Because something hasn't been done (much), doesn't mean it's impossible or even hard. If I didn't know better, I could almost think sticking a crosshair on your screen was a hardware requirement...

[Gawain]

I don't know if I missed any but another move I would like is sideways rolling.  You go prone, roll sideways, roll under lasers/poison/laser mines.  This is not a crawl move.  You crouch, roll sideways, and at the end of your roll you are back in a crouched position.

no way. this would take away the whole anti-stealth use of them.

i suggest a teamwork gadget that's worth taking a slot: healing, un-trapping, mirrors and glass fibre, sabotage kit (maybe you could even trick camnet camers so that they always show an empty room), rapelling kit, etc

[greenday5494]

what i was saying, like papa skull, it would be hard to code, animate, etc. im trying to be realistic. papa skull, you got it backwards, im saying its hard to code etc, and the other dude is just flaming. w/e ill drop it, i dont want a flame-war.

[Vega]

Rolling sideways and crawling change the gameplay too much.  This is specifically why I stated in the beginning that I wanted to know if the ideas I presented would change the game too much.  Also, while I've always liked the idea of rappelling, it just doesn't seem to be tactically good unless the map is specifically designed for it.



Here, you gain the advantage of sneaking into the back of hacking an objective.  Obviously the dimensions are smaller but this is to show that rappel spots should be used for entrance purposes only.  It's a coop move so you should gain some tactical advantage for both spies being in an area at one time.  This is the only time I see repelling useful because you can't "jump down" since the height is too great and death would ensue.  Rappelling to kill a merc would be way too wasteful and too easy to detect, it just isn't worth it.

It would be useful because it provides a safer and quicker escape, you can't really be killed by a mine ( unless by a poison mine that is goin across the vent exit ), but the spy could just chaff the room or shoot the laser.

Where are you getting the idea that there's going to be a vent 50 ft high around every corner and in every hacking room just for the purpose of rappelling?  Take the current maps in CT and start adding random rappel spots and you should see what I mean.  Also, rappelling ISN'T fast, nor do I think our spies are superhuman.

Also it would be hard to nade the person who is lowering the spy becaus the spy getting lowered is somewhat blocking the vent.  Also the spies head is in a different spot so it would be harder to snipe.  Plus it would provide access to terminals or vantage points for spies.

No, it wouldn't be any harder to snipe a spy - it would be easier.  He's a sitting duck, literally.  Big deal you can't nade the guy who is in the vent.  Again, where are you getting the idea that a map is FILLED with 50 ft high openings in the ceiling that this is going to be SO useful.  People already know where vent spots are in the current maps and they check them when they go into a room.  It's going to be the same way with rappelling spots.

This is countered by the fact that spies are both preoccupied, if a merc is already in the room you are rappelling into then it is a guaranteed death, and the rappel spots would be found quickly and they would be defended as much as possible.

This will happen 90% of the time. 

[InvisibleMan999]

Rolling sideways and crawling change the gameplay too much.  This is specifically why I stated in the beginning that I wanted to know if the ideas I presented would change the game too much.  Also, while I've always liked the idea of rappelling, it just doesn't seem to be tactically good unless the map is specifically designed for it.

Well, if you're adding an animation, that's a lot of coding time. Not to mention you're asking for specific rappeling spots to be added to maps... This is a lot more coding time.

I think if you're using that much time to add something, it better affect game play. I mean, if it's such a small change that people don't even care and it just becomes "Oh cool, rappelling". It's not worth the programming time.

If you're going to implement a big change like this, it should be because you want to change gameplay in some way.

[Vega]

Well, if you're adding an animation, that's a lot of coding time. Not to mention you're asking for specific rappeling spots to be added to maps... This is a lot more coding time.

I'm sure there's initial coding, but coop spots are up to the map-designers, not the programmers. 

I think if you're using that much time to add something, it better affect game play. I mean, if it's such a small change that people don't even care and it just becomes "Oh cool, rappelling". It's not worth the programming time.

If you're going to implement a big change like this, it should be because you want to change gameplay in some way.

This is exactly what I've been saying/asking.  Refer to my first post and my last post.  You even quoted the part I italicized.  "Unless the map is specifically designed for it."  What I mean by that is not; HEY, let's do rappelling cause it's cool!  I asked several times for ideas to only be implemented if they are tactically worth it and affect game play in a positive way.